A PSA Regarding The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild and Our Review

As we get our review for The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild ready, we decided to put out a brief PSA regarding how we review games and hopefully dispel a bit of the narrative going around with the game.

If you haven’t looked at our Review Policy, you’ll find that we use the full review score here at Niche Gamer. We don’t believe in the common stigma that any game scored below an 8 or a 9 isn’t worth playing.

Coming from this, we factor in lots of things with a game’s review including the common things like: graphics, performance, story, audio, replayability, and more. Another factor is how a game stacks up compared to other entries in a series (if applicable), so hopefully this is educational.

Expect our thorough written and video review for The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild sometime this weekend.

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Michael Jordan

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Media, Marketing, Reviews, Interviews, and more. I do terrible things so you don't have to. Doing LIVE coverage of E3 to Tokyo Game Show for the last 10 years.

  • Neojames82

    Uh oh, I smell controversy on the horizon. But seriously, I think you guys tend to review games more objectively than most other rags out there.

  • Anon_Amous

    You don’t have to explain yourself. Just be more consistent than Jim Sterling. People are getting after him because he has bizarre double-standards, not because he didn’t care for Zelda.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    Shoulda spent this time making a PSA towards getting fire and pitchfork insurance.

  • Andrew Siribohdi

    I really like how you disclosed information to us. You are honest and explain yourself very well and I would rather have that instead of the constant praise.

    Keep up the good work, Niche Gamer!

  • catazxy

    Some zelda fanboys formed a scary mob, but being so late to the party, with the review, may actually be for the better.

  • bomblord

    Well it’s a good thing Zelda excels in all the departments you list as review factors and far exceeds its peers on most of them. ;p

  • TT

    I don’t watch Sterling, what exactly happened with his Zelda review?

  • dasCameo

    he gave the game 7/10 and criticised it.

  • Professor_Icepick

    After going on a long rant about how everyone should pirate Nintendo’s games because they skim YouTuber revenue.

  • bomblord

    He was going on for a few weeks about Zelda fanboys on Twitter. Has a huge fallout over Nintendo and how youtube content id flags his channel with their stuff going as far as encouraging pirating their games.

    And then happens to give it a 7/10 despite a glowing review.

  • TT

    I figure a good chunk of the issues are from cutting corners on Nintendo’s part in order to get all the stuff out for sales. Ironic for the whole “a rushed game is forever bad”. That being said, I really, really had high hopes for this, not to say it’s completely bad, but it should not have that many issues, both for the game and for the hardware.

  • totenglocke

    The fact that you posted this telegraphs that you’re going to give it a really bad review and then try to claim that “A 5/10 totally isn’t bad, guise!”.

  • Mr.Sixes

    Bomblord and icepick’s answers nail it better

  • Dewey Defeats Truman

    I don’t think a PSA like this is necessary. If all you care about when you see a review is the number at the end and not the everything else before it then you’re either a desperate fanboy trying to prove something or just someone looking for shitposting material.

  • InkViper

    Time to run a nichegamer review Poole on BOTW – 7.5

  • Mcbuzzer

    Over the “Horizon: Zero Dawn”? Heeheehee…

  • Denshi

    “double standards” still don’t warrant the overreaction to his criticism

  • 2501

    They form a scary mob every time a new Zelda gets dropped and reviewed. Hell they even got mad at the 7 or 8 scores that Skyward Sword got. Yeah, fuckin… Skyward Sword.

  • MadaoDeeDee

    “These reviews that rate 10-9-8 they are overlooking some massive stuff just because it’s the legend of Zelda.” ….Ummm “Realistically speaking” I think your views are reactionary to other reviews out, you’re practically saying that all these people/sites are dishonest & you are the only one who’s right!! The “it’s Zelda that’s why people give it high numbers card” is being thrown out so many times it’s become ugly, why don’t people say the same thing about GTA, Uncharted, Persona, Dark Souls when all these games are praised to the moon because they have a high profile name behind them? When GTA 5 released the frames were atrocious & it’s 97 on MC…This site has given Tales of Zestiria 8.5!! Atelier Shallie Plus a 9! Grand Kingdom an 8 while these games are really not anywhere near a 7 or 6 & some are below average! I’m playing it right now 20+ hours in & the game is great in almost every aspects, the frame rates issue is there but mostly confined to the starting area/dense grass. I’m not a huge Zelda fan but I hate when certain games are treated differently because they are either very popular or very “niche”.

    games that have frame rate issues as shown by Digital Foundry include many AAA titles from Last Guardian to Horizon to FF15 to Dishonored 2…even on the Pro PS4.

  • Mr0303

    I guess it would be scary to rate a highly praised game like Zelda with a lower score. You’ll likely be accused of clickbait. I do think that this disclaimer is not necessary – you will face backlash, but you should stand by your review.

    This is a prime example of how toxic scoring games has become.

  • Not a 5…. but we have talked about it quite a bit. You will have to see, we list in detail the issues.

  • Nagato

    “Coming from this, we factor in lots of things with a game’s review including the common things like: graphics, performance, story, audio, replayability, and more.”

    I call bs: you gave Yarn Yoshi a 10 despite that being a 2D platformer running at only 30fps on normal 3DS devices.

  • Well if you looked at our FF15 review you would see we dont hold back.

  • MadaoDeeDee

    You’e right, but your site is not just FF15 review & to be honest the frames are the least worrisome problem with that game.

    All I’m saying is people especially who write reviews should never care about other sites reviews or how much popular or niche the game is & what the guy said in the video above seems extremely reactionary no matter how you look at it.

  • catazxy

    “B-But it’s Zelda!”

  • How does being a 2D playformer that runs perfectly and has great design and mechanices and is also a totally different game discredit anything?

  • Bitterbear

    [sarc]Everyone knows that games that don’t run at 60fps minimum are trash[/sarc].

  • Bitterbear

    I just want to know if the Ass-shaped rock formation survived the Beta stage of the game:

    http://i.imgur.com/B234Fb5.png

  • catazxy

    I know, and not even one reviewer mentions that, how can I make an informed purchase when I don’t have that piece of information?

  • Bitterbear

    That was shown at the very end of lengthy gameplay demo last October. So yeah, I’m obsessed with a literally rock-hard ass.

  • chaz

    Less than 8 confirmed :p

  • Bitterbear

    Oh! Found the video and the timestamp:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdiKzCzLdpo&t=1980

  • Dr. Roswell. W

    Back in 2006 there was a Major Shitstorm when Twilight Princess received an 8.8. So this doesn’t surprise me.

  • Kelborne

    I still remember the rage they got when Gametrailers gave Uncharted 2 a 9.3. Out of 10. People are idiots.

  • chaoguy

    Sarc aside, 30FPS/60FPS should be mentioned as it is an issue for some. Niche reviewers are written in such a way you can say “Eh, he didn’t like this, but I don’t mind. I’ll give a point back to the final score”.
    Frame drops- whether it’s supposed to run at 60 or 30- is unforgivable IMO.

  • totenglocke

    Game reviews are like grades in school. A 7-8 is “perfectly average”, a 6-7 is pretty bad, and any less is just awful. I’ve logged about 50 hours into the game, so I don’t need to “wait and see” someone try to get cool points by trashing the best game I’ve played in at least a decade.

    You know that you’re intentionally going that “bad rating to be trendy” route or you never would have posted this PSA. This gives me the vibe of that review a few months ago where the guy who hates RPGs reviewed an RPG and (surprise!) gave it a mediocre score. This is exactly why I rely on user reviews to make purchasing decisions and almost never bother to read a “professional” review.

  • totenglocke

    More an example of people who intentionally give bad reviews for clicks / “cool points” know that what they’re doing is bogus and are trying to do preemptive damage control.

  • totenglocke

    Nah, a score that high wouldn’t get a PSA. I’m betting sub-6 because it’s cool to hate Nintendo purely for not being named Microsoft / Sony.

  • Shinoji

    Looks like Travis found a new buddy /s

  • Michael Richardson

    Heh, low-ish score incoming. It doesn’t need a PSA. The only people who freak out about low scores are fanatical fanboys, and you’re not going to sway them with a PSA before the reviews drop. Review the game, state your reasons for the score, and stand by that opinion if you think it’s valid.

    Can’t agree with what you said in the video about the review scores, though. 10/10 doesn’t (shouldn’t, at least) mean it’s flawless. A 10/10 is a game with gameplay good enough to transcend the normal video-gamey experience and become something special. Call bullshit if you want, I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, but I don’t think it’s fair to call reviewers who gave it a 10/10 “dishonest.’ For all its flaws, the game is a fucking masterpiece in certain (very big) respects. It’s certainly one of the best Nintendo games I’ve ever played.

  • Bashtarle

    And? A decent number of the 10/10 reviews I read brought up some of the same issues he brought up. Then inexplicably just decided not to dock the game points for them.

  • Fandangle

    It’s in the game. it’s on the plateu in its full glory next to the first talus boss. If you look right on you can even see a dick and balls.

  • bomblord

    It could have just been bad timing but it seemed to be in spite. Especially after giving horizon a 9.

    Fan reactions were just outright stupid over the top though like yeesh.

  • patyos

    Not surprised tons of games were more fun then zelda this year even RE7, Tales of Berseria and Nier:Automata.

  • Donwel

    Uh oh. 7 incoming then?
    Not that 7 is a bad score obviously, but we know what fanboys are like.

  • Shinoji

    You do realize that grades and review scores are different, right? 5 is average, 6-7 is good, 8-9 is great, and 10 would be amazing. Or something to that effect. Anything less than 4 is considered sub-par or with bad performance, glitches, etc. In short, something that isn’t even good on a technical level. Most games would be a 5 to 7. At least, that SHOULD be how review scores are categorized.

    And as for the PSA, the only reason they added it is because there are nutjobs who go apeshit and try to discredit the reviewers for not liking their game as much as they have.

    And honestly, I’d tend to agree with you; other than NicheGamer, I only trust user reviews like Steam’s. Could you give a link to that review you just mentioned, by the way?

  • Bitterbear

    Thank you! Now I can die in peace.

  • bomblord

    I’ll refer back to this if points are docked for FPS.

  • Donwel

    10 is (or should be) a perfect score, but for the last 15-20 years, maybe longer, mainstream outlets have been giving perfect 10s to games that are not perfect which has devalued the 10/10 rating.

  • Shinoji

    Looking forward to the review regardless. I already bought the game myself on Wii U, but looking at other’s opinions on it will be interesting, especially if they mention any flaws, ’cause I personally never noticed any.

  • Pilebunker

    “it’s cool to hate Nintendo purely for not being named Microsoft / Sony.”
    How can you even say that with a straight face when people shit on Sony, and especially Microsoft, all the time? Nintendo has shown to be on the same level as the other 2. Bringing all the cancerous practices with them like paid online and going as far as to locking hard mode behind on disc DLC.

  • patyos

    Can’t wait to see the review :D

    Loved the Berseria and Zestiria review =D

    Currently reading the Nioh one.

  • Michael Richardson

    I imagine there is a bit of trepidation about posting a critical review after Jim Sterling got DDOS’d for his review.

    I’ll read the review and, if I disagree with the author, I’ll let him know about my disagreements in the comments. Respectfully, of course.

    I just completed my first playthrough. 65+ hours in. Absolutely incredible experience.

  • bomblord

    It boggles my mind anyone can find glaring flaws in the switch version of this game.

  • bomblord

    You definitely played a different game than the one I’m currently 70 hours into

  • Michael Richardson

    Sony is extremely popular these days. I don’t see very many people shitting on them.

    I don’t necessarily agree with totenglocke’s comment, but people have been trolling the shit out of Nintendo communities these last few months. It has gotten extremely obnoxious.

  • Kasparius

    Hey, I get it, a 75/100 will get you way more clicks from Metacritic than a 100/100. Totally reasonable for a small time site like yours to get on the map any old way you can.

    Seriously though, the Monday morning quaterback reviews backlash is completely unfair, if this review was made in a vacuum where you had no idea it was getting rave reviews, you could probably not wait to give it top marks.

    I’m not saying the game is flawless, I’m hundreds of hours in and even though the list of things I love is pages long, there are things I don’t like about the game. But still, this game is such a triumph of game design and gameplay that I really think the backlash is a completely poseur insincere thing, and you won’t be able to convince me otherwise.

  • Pilebunker

    I love the Vita but still feel like Sony can not remove their head from their rear at times. Like the memory card prices and terrible Vita PSN store. Or how you now have to pay for online yet PS+ deals and bundles are now just filled with indie games no one wants to play. I believe the Nintendo hate these days comes from the anti-consumer decisions they’ve made as of late. It can be obnoxious at times with some just plain shitposting. Saying that though, I don’t care for any of the big 3 and only like a small handful of devs/publishers.

  • totenglocke

    It cracks me up when people want to use a completely different system to rate games than how literally everything else is judged. You just say that to justify bad reviews of good games due to personal biases.

    Is Breath of the Wild perfect? No, nothing is ever perfect. Is it a fucking amazing game that almost everyone will love? Yes.

  • Kelborne

    Aw, man. there was an entire line of people waiting to convince you. What should they do now? Do you even think about how your posts affect other people?

  • SuuLoliBoob

    What ever you choose, i won’t care. Just as long as you keep it honest and don’t grade it by a bias.

    I honestly think it’s a 8/10, not a master piece like a lot of people are grading it, but a little more then above average like a 7 like what jim gave it. But that’s just me, you do you, NicheGamer, you do you.

  • CrusaderEsper

    Realistically speaking, all a “low” score for this game will do is lower the overall average on Metacritic, drive tons of people to the site yelling “clickbait”, and potentially damage the Nichegamer brand in the minds of people that disagree with the score given. I’m all for using the whole review scale but the fact that you guys thought a PSA was warranted has me a little worried.

  • SuuLoliBoob

    This so much.

  • RetroGamer

    I can agree with that. When scoring a game in my mind, I mostly base it upon how much fun I had.

  • RetroGamer

    Could be wrong, but reading this really gives me the impression that a 7 or 7.5 is incoming.

  • totenglocke

    It’s cute how optimistic you are. ☺️

  • RetroGamer

    It’s one of the best games I’ve played in years. My few complains are that it lacked the memorable music of past titles, equipment broke too quickly with no option to repair most of it and the dungeons were a bit same-ish.

  • Michael Richardson

    They’re definitely not perfect, but I still really enjoy Nintendo’s games and hardware, as well as Sony’s, to a lesser extent. I don’t mind reasonable criticism, but the concern trolling is getting to be a bit much.

    As to the Vita: I love mine, but Sony will never do right by it. Thankfully, it got enough Japanese and indie support to have a half-way decent library. I prefer my 3DS, but I really appreciate the sleek hardware and quirky games.

    PS4 is extremely popular at the moment, though. And it deserves to be: while I’m not a huge fan of the hardware, I think Sony has done a good job of making it a very accessible platform with access to a huge number of high-quality titles.

    My big 3, in terms of who I tend to support the most, are Nintendo, ATLUS, and Marvelous USA (XSeed).

  • RetroGamer

    It’s speculation at this point, but we’ll both know soon enough.

  • InkViper

    Niche gamer isn’t polygon.

  • InkViper

    How dare you sir, now go wash your mouth out with soap.

  • totenglocke

    True, but I really don’t think a 7+ would warrant this article and the author of the post himself replied to me earlier saying that it “not a 5, but…”.

  • totenglocke

    I used to agree, but go skim the reviews this guy (Michael Jordan) has written and compare those games to Breath of the Wild (if you’ve played it). I’ve played at least some amount of most of the games he’s written reviews for and I’ve logged about 50 hours of Breath of the Wild. There’s no way a rational person gives Yoshi’s Wooly World a 10, Bloodborne a 9, and Final Fantasy XV a 7.5 and then puts Breath of the Wild beneath all of those.

  • Bitterbear

    Also, don’t forget how Twitter users are implying that an IGN employee got fired for giving the Nintendo Switch console a 7/10.

    People wanted Nintendo to be more like the other video game developer/publishers. This is their wish come true.

  • Shinoji

    What do you mean? Almost every rating system that’s a multiple of 10 has the halfway mark being average, and categorizes quality like I just described. And how is that justifying it? It’s not my fault that your personal rating system is completely incompatible to most others, and frankly, absurd.

    And that’s pretty fucking presumptuous to say about Breath of the Wild, and I’m saying this as a fan of the game.

  • Shinoji

    I’m only 10-20 hours in, but I didn’t mind the equipment breaking. I always tend to screw around with them too much anyway, and I usually find a decent spear or so, since I tend to just wander around a bit.

  • OldPalpy

    “Nice site you got there shame if something happened to it” that’s pretty much what you’re saying because they might not be drinking the flavoraid here.

  • Pilebunker

    “The “it’s Zelda that’s why people give it high numbers card” is being thrown out so many times it’s become ugly”
    Because when they do give it an honest grading that they feel is below an 8, they get heavy backlash like this except on a much wider scale because people can’t accept their favorite childhood franchise being given anything less than the best grades. You haven’t even read his review yet and you’re already assuming he’s going to completely shit on it simply for being popular.

    “why don’t people say the same thing about GTA, Uncharted, Persona, Dark
    Souls when all these games are praised to the moon because they have a
    high profile name behind them?”
    But they do unless you’re just not looking. GTA 5 was considered a step down from 4 with many things but driving. Uncharted games have constantly been shat on by many people who even call the games “movies” due to being so scripted. Persona (mainly 3 and 4) are considered a step down gameplay wise compared to 2. Especially 4 which is so barebones in mechanics even Dragon Quest games have more depth (personally I really disliked P4). Dark Souls has been talked to death about its pros and cons. And on the high profile thing. Persona nearly didn’t exist in the western radar until 3 made it big and Dark Souls only had Demon’s Souls which was pretty niche its self. So you can’t even use that argument for those 2 series.

    “When GTA 5 released the frames were atrocious & it’s 97 on MC…”
    No one takes Metacritic seriously for various reasons. Whether it be “professional” or user scores.

    “This site has given Tales of Zestiria 8.5!! Atelier Shallie Plus a 9!
    Grand Kingdom an 8 while these games are really not anywhere near a 7 or
    6 & some are below average!”
    I may not agree with all their scores as well but I see no problem with it as long as they give good reasoning to why they like certain aspects, don’t lying, or simply ignore obvious faults. What one niche may like another may not. I may not like Persona 4 because it’s too barebones for me unlike Dungeon Travelers 2. Many could hate Dungeon Travelers 2 because it’s too complex to the point you can’t easily relax while playing it and the monstergirl designs aren’t nearly as cool as actual monsters.

    ” I’m not a huge Zelda fan but I hate when certain games are treated
    differently because they are either very popular or very “niche”.”
    I see what you mean. Saying that though. There aren’t many sites that understand niche games yet grade them while doing so. This doesn’t mean I want only niche games to get high scores (honestly I hate grades at the end of reviews personally) but to be graded more fairly. But people who understand them. As for AAA games, I feel many don’t get the polish they need and end up being mediocre experiences which is why I don’t see a problem with them getting 6 or 7.

  • InkViper

    I believe Michael reviews with a preference for two particular points, first being technical proficiency in the framework of the game (i.e. frame rates, glitches/bugs, proper QA testing and the like) second artistic and technical execution of gameplay mechanics (i.e. responsive and accurate control inputs, intelligent game play environment design based off the logical integration from solid gameplay mechanics) which leads me to believe that if these elements aren’t necessarily implemented particularly well, he will raise the issue and dockt the game accordingly. And if I’m right the three examples you showed me with the review scores doesn’t surprise me, if he uses these criteria that I’ve highlighted as his prime focus.

  • Joe

    A consistent inability to maintain even the basic quality standard of 30fps is not a glaring flaw??

  • Pardon me but this is the first time I’ve ever seen this irrelevant, flavor of the weekend non-game being played, and that is the most gaudy UI I’ve seen in long-ass time, it’s like something they left in the game from the engine test, Christ.

  • totenglocke

    Almost no console game runs at a steady frame rate.

  • Bashtarle

    To be fair most games tend to get a better review/response during the “honeymoon” period. You usually get a better feel for what people really think about a month or two out. When things have had time to settle and those small overlookable inconveniences start accumulating into full blown grievances.

  • Bashtarle

    To be fair most games tend to get a better review/response during the “honeymoon” period. You usually get a better feel for what people really think about a month or two out. When things have had time to settle and those small overlookable inconveniences start accumulating into full blown grievances.

  • TheOnceAndFutureKing

    Fanboys are annoying, but its also just as annoying when people go the hipster route and purposely call the game shit just to spite the fanboys.

  • Mr0303

    The review is not out yet. How do you know that it’s bad?

  • totenglocke

    Scroll through the comments here and see when the author responded to me. He made it clear that they’re giving it a very bad score

  • Mr0303

    At one point he said that it’s not a 5, so this means it’s more, which would be an above average score. Plus you said that the review will be bad – this is not the same as the score.

  • totenglocke

    A 5 is way below average, no matter how much some people want to ignore the scale that everything else is based on. Even grades in school are measured this way.

    “Plus you said that the review will be bad – this is not the same as the score”

    And now you’re just being intentionally obtuse.

  • Mr0303

    “A 5 is way below average, no matter how much some people want to ignore the scale that everything else is based on.” – it’s a 10 point scale. 5 is an average score. You seem to be ignoring that for whatever reason, possibly to paint the 6 or 7 Zelda will get as “bad”. I’m afraid this is not how mathematics and averages work.

    “Even grades in school are measured this way.” – I’m not sure where are you studying, but in my book a C is an average grade and E/F is a bad one. Plus what do school grades have to do with gaming reviews?

    “And now you’re just being intentionally obtuse.” – no, I’m being pedantic. A review is not the same as the score – you haven’t read the review and have no idea what it’ll say about the game.

  • Bashtarle

    Also a lack of arrow crafting, so bows get a double whammy. You would think it would make sense to be able to craft arrows with the various jellies to impart elemental effects. I mean they went to town with cooking and then didn’t do anything else with any other crafting.

  • RetroGamer

    Now that you mention it, using the different chuchu gels to give gear elemental properties would make perfect sense.

  • Tyrannikos

    Preemptively justifying your review seems really tacky. Put the review out and stand by your thoughts. This is just weird.

  • Tyrannikos

    I think only the American school system is retarded enough to fuck up a simple 10-scale. Holding game review scores to that same standard seems dumb.

  • Bashtarle

    Yeah it is kinda funny I remember getting flak for taking issue with the fact Skyward Sword padded it’s game play out by forcing you to run through the same zone map(s) three plus times. Now it seems to be on everyone Zelda shit list, when other than that I actually kinda liked it.

    Breath of the Wild actually gives me the same kind of general feeling with some of the duplicate shrines and pretty much all of the koroks. Since there are like three or four korok puzzles that are recycled ad nauseam in the form of little Pavlovian busy works.

  • scemar

    just don’t try to give it a low score to be different and edgy or controversial or special
    give it something honest and reasonable that it will be believable
    this sort of disclaimer is making me think you’ll give it a 7 just because of the frame rate issues or something silly like that despite all that it actually achieves as a game and all that it means to the franchise by going so deep into gameplay after giving gamers the middle finger with skyward sword last time

  • Cy

    God I remember this. Although, IGN were the ones getting the hate, so I got to laugh at everybody involved, lol.

  • Zombie_Barioth

    The only one who’s using a completely different system is you. Scores are done on a scale, not grade averages. Go order some curry as an 8/10 and see how “average” the heat is. Or tell a doctor you’re “average” pain is an 8.

    Even on Metacritic 5 is considered average, hence the yellow marker.

    This mindset that anything below an 8 is ‘bad’ is why reviewers are so afraid of using half the scale in the first place, and makes reviews like theirs seem so contrarian.

  • Zombie_Barioth

    There’s also him foretelling he’ll probably rate it lower than everybody else, and his ‘investigation’ into the metacritic trolling being matching usernames to Horizon reviews then pointing fingers at Zelda fans.

    I agree it could just be mere coincidence, but it also does seem to be out of spite, or at least him trying to be contrarian.

  • Completely agree. It’s why if I talk about games among friends, I never give them a score, because they’re too dependent on subjectivity. Instead, what I do is tell them about what makes the game worthwhile.

  • I’m sorry, but you’re being ridiculous with these review scores. If I recall, the other reviews Niche Gamer publish make no direct comparison with other games as a judgement of quality, unless it’s explicitly discussed. So even if you try to compare scores for consistency’s sake, you can’t, as these games were reviewed before Breath of the Wild came out anyway. Michael is more than likely reviewing games based on their individual merits and not trying to compare them all with each other.

    Shit like this is why I don’t personally use numbers to measure a game’s quality anymore, because you get fanatics having a conniption if someone dares to give a game a lower score than the average. I did this shit when I was a teenager and, well, there’s a reason I stopped after I became an adult.

  • Travis Touchdown

    Give it anything lower than a 10 and you will regret it.

  • totenglocke

    So in your country, getting half of the answers wrong is average? Sounds like a horrible education system.

  • Tyrannikos

    I’m American. The American grading system is horrible though, yes.

    I won’t pretend to understand how all other countries work. They really could be just as bad, but that’s beside my point.
    I still don’t believe the same standards of grading scales for schooling should be used in the same way reviewing something is.

  • Madbrainbox

    Good luck.Fanboys can be really shitty at times.

  • Madbrainbox

    Go on.Regret it how?

  • Godmars

    Isn’t that the issue? Other reviewers point out problems with the game yet give it a perfect score, Jim gives it a positive honest one and gets flayed for it by fanboy zealots.

  • Heresy Hammer

    Shitstorm incoming.

  • Kiryu

    Maybe Travis will boycott NG if Zelda doesn’t get a 10.

  • anonymousretard

    i ignore celeb type reviewers

    they get more caught up in their character(s) than the game

    because in the end, whats the point of a score when what should matter is how fun the game was for you, did you enjoy it?

  • John Myers

    I generally agree with devil’s advocate scoring of titles as prestigious as Zelda, as they usually need these lower reviews to bring light to glaring flaws and bugs that the super fan regime will just rationalize to look or completely overlook.

    That said, I have played about 80hrs of BotW, and bought on launch day with the day 1 update. I have seen the slowdowns in docked play, some gameplay jitters at times and yes they are unpleasant, but in no flippin way are they immersion breaking or quantify a full integer or more drop on a 10 digit review schema. The game is most likely getting a barrage of perfect scores because it’s such a breath of fresh air to review outlets, and is rightfully a Masterpiece. Don’t forget it’s A FRIGGIN LAUNCH TITLE on an unproven systen format that had most reviewer preliminary scoring scales tared low to begin with. Darn near every interactive physics system in play works FLAWLESSLY, and in both output metrics… 900p and 720p. For a reviewer to give this game a 7, I respectfully believe, that you are countering what you may dislike about the barrage of perfect scores on ANY game, and are way over valuing Zelda BotW’s noted flaws.

  • CyborgNinja

    As long as your criticisms are reasonable and well thought out there should not be a problem. I myself am usually pretty critical of video games, especially the ones I love.
    Having said that, I personally have never played a Zelda game before BotW and I have to say I loved it. I even played on WiiU because I’m not willing to spend 400 EUR on a system just to play one game. Except for the occasional frame rate drop I experienced no other technical problems. Therefore I am really intrigued as to what problems there might be that I overlooked.

  • Tubsiwub

    I agree with you. Seeing as there isn’t a “perfect game”, 10/10 stands for “Outstanding” rather than “Perfect”.

  • Tubsiwub

    Grand Kingdom especially was super boring… uhg.

  • After playing it for over 100 hours, I honestly think anything lower than 8.5 is insane. It just excels so much at everything except performance and dungeons.

  • It usually does maintain it though. It doesn’t drop much more frequently than other AAA games.

  • MadaoDeeDee

    Maybe you’re right, even if I don’t think that, for ex. No Man’s Sky was hyped beyond belief yet the reviews “collectively” didn’t like the game & pointed the massive flaws at almost the same week or less.

    The video above seems to fall under the reactionary opinion not a professional/unbiased one at all & that is why I commented because it looked like someone is “reviewing” the game & hating it because it’s getting “10s, 9s, 8s” & spouting the same excuse…”people are only loving it because it’s Zelda” or whatever big name you wanna put! So unprofessional + the “9, 8, 8.5” reviews I mentioned above are another reason I say bullshit.

  • I have been playing it a lot too, 3 Guardian dungeon , 87 shrine completed some memories done, and i have no real complaint about the game, i did run in a few bug wich made me reload the game prior the accident ( Goron refusing to follow or simply move while climbing the mountain )
    It’s a great game, but definetly not perfect.

  • Don Tworry

    “I’m not sure where are you studying, but in my book a C is an average
    grade and E/F is a bad one. Plus what do school grades have to do with
    gaming reviews?”

    I think he means that school grades and game review scores are on a similar scale. If someone gets anything below a 60 they have failed in school. Likewise, if a game gets below that they failed as well. Even though 50 should be average since it’s the halfway point of the out of a 100 scale, that’s not how it actually works.

  • Travis Touchdown

    It will be all I really need to demonstrate just how corrupt this site really is.

  • Travis Touchdown

    It’ll be interesting to see how he justifies giving it a seven.

  • Travis Touchdown

    No, they’re reviewing a game we fanboys have already played and beat it at this point. They’re going to have a hard time trying to justify this score, I think.
    Only hardcore niche gamer fanboys who haven’t played the game will side with them.

  • Mr0303

    Even if the system is in place that somebody fails if he gets an overall 50% a C is still an average grade.

    “Likewise, if a game gets below that they failed as well.” – says who? Every site scores games differently and a 5 is clearly an average grade for most.

    “Even though 50 should be average since it’s the halfway point of the out of a 100 scale, that’s not how it actually works.” – if the site’s review policy says that 50 is average then it is. Simple as that.

  • Himegami Aisa

    The fuck is this bullshit? What were you trying to achieve other than looking spineless and petty?

    First of all, accusing most other outlets of straight up deceiving their readers is a grave charge indeed, and you back it up with… some waffle about the supposedly dire problems with the game, the only one which you could provide being the thing fucking every review mentions: framerate issues. Journalism.

    The other part of the video is just pre-empting the inevitable backlash towards the score (which I’m sure at this point is totally untainted by the aforementioned accusations) using the bizarre examples of Fallout 3 and fucking Skyrim as games that didn’t receive exceptional praise in the face of massive bugginess (might wanna look up Skyrim on Metacritic). All this is doing is making you look insecure about the rating, like you think your review won’t stand on its merits.

    Frankly this rant just comes across as unprofessional— the kinda shit I’d expect from a career Youtuber, not from an outlet that wishes to craft an image of respectability. I honestly don’t care what you decide to rate it, just don’t whine to me about it.

  • Travis Touchdown

    Yes, this is something I wished I myself had pointed out last night. According to Niche Gamer, the opinions of all the other outlets who gave the game perfect scores are not to be trusted. They are lying to you, you can only trust OUR objective review.

  • catazxy

    The only reason you don’t see more games that get a 5 score, is because most sites don’t have time to play everything, so they pick and choose what looks interesting or is already popular.

  • Travis Touchdown

    I’ve long maintained that Nichegamer is one of the most corrupt anti Nintendo sites out there.

    I think them giving BOTW a poor score (For a game like this, anything lower than a 10 is unacceptable) is really going to drive the idea home among general audiences that they are JUST an online gaming tabloid and aren’t to be trusted.

  • GlacialSolace

    Give the game whatever review score you want. However, I will point out that, dispite its flaws, it is a much better game than either Yoshi’s Wooly World or Tales of Zestiria, both of which received positive reviews. This “PSA” smacks of hyping up a contrarian review, which I hope is not the case.

  • Travis Touchdown

    Woolly World is a great game. It’s just not a 10/10 game, sadly.

    Those boss fights were super underwhelming.

  • Dale Frewaldt

    Fanboys out in force and this isn’t even the review.

  • Don Tworry

    “says who? Every site scores games differently and a 5 is clearly an average grade for most.”

    I should have said “it looks like they failed as well.” I agree, it shouldn’t be seen as a failure, but if a game has anything below a 70 it’s seen as a failure as well. When it comes to game reviews it’s more so about perception than anything.

    “if the site’s review policy says that 50 is average then it is. Simple as that.”

    I couldn’t tell you any gaming’s site’s review policies besides Niche Gamer’s. If there are any that say this I’d like to know because very few people treat 50 like an average score. So when sites don’t explain their review systems people just liken them to one they are more experienced with like the school grading system. This would be where the confusion and outrage comes from.

  • Madbrainbox

    And you will do what exactly?

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    You are the same guy who shitposts nonstop and acts like Nintendo has never made anything that wasn’t 10/10 perfect.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    NG, I respect you for what you’re about to do (apply a score according to an actual 1-10 scale), and I’m sorry that it is going to bring down such a harsh and merciless angry mob upon you.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    They gave Zestiria a good score? Seriously? Whenever someone tells me they liked that game I always have to wonder if that person also enjoys eating trash out of a dumpster.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    If you’ve never played Zelda, then BOTW is mindblowing. It’s like Nintendo made their own Skyrim, I don’t blame people for being like “10/10 best game ever” cuz it’s fun cutesy Skyrim and people love that kind of thing, clearly.

    The game itself is good, but compared to previous Zelda games, frankly, it’s not a masterpiece, at least not of combat or story (the two big points of prior games).

    For people who have played every Zelda game prior, BOTW feels more like too little butter scraped over literally miles of bread. The only real motivation to finish Divine Beasts (the “core dungeons” so to speak) is for the OP abilities they give you that trivialize the game’s few challenging elements. (Mipha is a free revive every few minutes, Gale makes climbing effortless and makes easy puzzles even easier, Faruk lets you just tank hits for free, it’s crazy.)

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    Interesting to note that Skyward Sword (widely considered the ‘weakest’ Zelda game) also got rave reviews from fans and critics alike when it first launched. Zelda games always have a ‘honeymoon period’ of about 1 yr before people become overly critical of it and begin comparing it to prior games.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    I hope they give it a 1, and the sheer indignant disbelief fries your circuits and we can finally be rid of you.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    Is it really that weird? Have you forgotten about 8.8?

  • Mr0303

    “I agree, it shouldn’t be seen as a failure, but if a game has anything
    below a 70 it’s seen as a failure as well. When it comes to game reviews
    it’s more so about perception than anything.” – that’s a problem with the readers, not the reviewer. How the hell can a reviewer change the perception in order to convince a certain reader that a game with a 7 score is actually good?

    “So when sites don’t explain their review systems people just liken them
    to one they are more experienced with like the school grading system.
    This would be where the confusion and outrage comes from.” – well, then people should read Niche Gamer’s and any other site’s review policy before treating 60/70 as a “bad” score. The responsibility is on the readers. In my view even the PSA above is not necessary.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    “Realistically, having integrity is going to hurt your brand”

  • Travis Touchdown

    Because being angry at an unfair review is so unjustified, right?

  • Dale Frewaldt

    You don’t even know what the review score is or whether said score is fair.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    What exactly does it triumph in, that isn’t simply Nintendo catching up with the last 4 years of game mechanics and trends? I like the game too, but I also liked Skyrim (as did most) and Skyrim was the posterchild of “games with glaring flaws that can get away with launching like this because they’re fun.”

    The game is addictive, it has a good gameplay loop that makes people want to get lost in it, but as a complete package beyond its scope (story, combat, presentation) it is shallow as fuck. It’s not fair to devs who get trashed for framerate issues (The Last Guardian?) that Zelda gets a pass simply for being Zelda. And in the story department, this doesn’t even approach Twilight Princess or Majora’s Mask. I actually preferred the opening of Skyward Sword to this one– because the SS prologue had *people in it!* Things *happened*! You hung out with Zelda, her relationship to Link and her role in their world was established (even if it takes like an hour too long). In this game, to figure out what the fuck is even going on at all you have to go to randomly dispersed FlashBack Sparkles to get piecemeal bits of info about who this world’s Zelda was, why Link or the player should care about her, etc. And most players are not gonna find all of the story or even most of it (since the locations are unmarked). It’s disjointed, it’s slightly incoherent, and you’re sort of experiencing both the story of stuff Link remembers (but the player doesn’t) 100 years prior, AND the story currently happening in present time. It’s a bit odd.

    However I will say, I am glad they scrapped their original build where the Sheikah Slate had a voice and would talk through the gamepad.

  • Shinoji

    Comparing those games with Breath of the Wild makes no sense in my eyes. One’s a platforming game, another is a turn-based RPG. Breath of the Wild is an open-world action-adventure game. They’re nothing alike in gameplay, so why are you comparing them?

  • totenglocke

    How is shitting on a fantastic game just for clicks “having integrity”? Though with the number of comments on this post alone, they’re raking in the clicks from making a controversy out of nothing.

  • Shinoji

    “accusing most other outlets of straight up deceiving their readers”
    Where did you find that?

  • Shinoji

    >NicheGamer
    >Corrupt
    >Anti-Nintendo

    If it wasn’t for the fact that you’re more than likely completely serious about this, my sides would’ve become fucking hailey’s comet right then and there, leaving the solar system and only coming back every 75 years.

  • CyborgNinja

    That is a good point, since I have not played any Zelda games prior to BotW I do not really have a frame of reference to compare the game to.
    I do agree that the abilities you get for clearing the Divine Beasts tend to be a little overpowered. Since they were the last thing I did in my play-through I did not really use them much which might have played into my enjoying the game more.

  • Tyrannikos

    Don’t even know what 8.8 refers to, unfortunately.

  • Shinoji

    Because they might see the flaws that some of us aren’t able to see?

  • 2501

    At the end of the day it’s just a score, a digit. It’s a very petty thing to take seriously when it’s subjective, NG could give Nier Automata a 5 and i wouldn’t give a fuck, the game is fun to me.

  • Travis Touchdown

    This PSA video says all you need to know.

  • Arenegeth

    I hope you guys aren’t going the Jim Sterling route…

    For those who don’t know, Jim Sterling pretty much made a career by giving a lot of good games a bad review, and a lot of bad games a good review.

    That caused him to receive a lot of attention (kinda how this topic has), by people questioning the arbitrary number of his reviews, since it was ‘controversial’.

    He always claimed that he never did that for attention and he was just giving us his honest ‘opinion’, but in my opinion when that sort of thing is happening consistently, you either are doing it on purpose, or you simply have shitty taste. I’ll let other people draw their own conclusions.

    Since this tactic worked out for Jim (purposefully or not), I will not downplay its effectiveness, but I will also not fail to mention how unethical and underhanded it is. It would also be especially bad, if it was used by a site, which, hypothetically speaking of course, build its audience on the back of a controversy involving the bad ethical standards of other more mainstream outlets.

    Disclaimer: I don’t give a shit about reviews, I can’t stress this enough. Review numbers even less, I was always against them, I will always be against them, you simply cannot distill the value of a gaming experience down to an arbitrary number decided by a random individual of dubious understanding of game mechanics or gaming experience.

    I already bought this new Zelda game, twice. I have no opinion on its quality since for stupid personal reasons (that involve Amiibo and a broken rumble motor) I haven’t gotten around to playing it yet. But whether you were to give it a 1 or a 10, it will literally mean the same to me and I wasn’t going to read the review anyway.

    Having said all that, I have seen Metacritic review politics ruin sites before, and the general bullshit surrounding conflict involving review scores nauseates me, and I was hoping to avoid them on this site. But I guess not…

  • AuraMaster DX (austin9568)

    From Tvtropes
    The name comes from the unimaginable havoc created by GameSpot’s review of the Wii version of The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess in November 2006, which awarded the game a great-but-not-amazing score of 8.8 out of 10. The Internet erupted in anger and chaos, as Twilight Princess was one of the most anticipated games of all time and near-perfect/perfect scores were expected. Ironically, GameSpot gave the GameCube version of the game a score of 8.9, despite claiming the Wii version was superior.note The reason for the score discrepancy is that the Wii was theoretically a more powerful console than the GameCube, so the Wii version’s score was adjusted downward as a result

  • Zero Eternity

    It is in the video. Hopefully they release the review today and explain their thoughts on the game’s issues.

  • Madbrainbox

    “I’ve long maintained that Nichegamer is one of the most corrupt anti Nintendo sites out there.”

    Let’s review some of the evidence:
    Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate- 9.5
    Shin Megami Tensei Devil Survivor 2- 9
    Etrian Odyssey 2 Untold: The Fafnir Knight-9.5
    The Legend of Legacy-5.5
    Stella Glow-7
    Hyrule Warriors Legends-7.5
    Kirby: Planet Robobot-9
    7th Dragon III Code: VFD-8
    Pokemon Sun and Moon-8.5
    Poochy and Yoshi’s Woolly World-10
    1 score of 5.5 one of 7 and one of 7.5.The rest are over 8.And they have a 10 in there as well.So how are they anti-Nintendo again?

  • AuraMaster DX (austin9568)

    “Eventually his sides stopped thinking”

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    The internet collectively lost its shit when Jeff Gerstmann at Gamespot gave Twilight Princess an 8.8 score, the forums were swamped with insults at Jeff and even people calling for him to be fired.

  • Cats736

    7/10 is a pretty good score.

  • Zero Eternity

    The chaos is the comments funny. I wonder why people seem to think 10 out of 10 is right though. There is no video game out there that deserves a perfect score. It is like saying it is getting a 100 out 100 comparatively. Jittery frame rates alone would take that down by 5 points alone without knowing actually how bad the issue is. Gaming is also completely subjective. People give or take points for the same issue.

    Take “Dark Souls” like hard bosses. One person would say they didn’t like the game and take points for it while another would give points. Same with “lewd” content in a game. This always affects game scores by people critiquing the game while going in disliking anything showing boobs.

    A lot of times dropping game scores by 20-30 points out of one hundred or 2-3 out of 10 just for that while disregarding how good the game play might be. Point is reviewing is subjective to whether a person liked the game going in and what aspects he/she considers important. As long as a person explains why they think that way in the review then their opinion is still valid even if you think they are nuts.

    Either way kudos to NG on getting all these comments out of the way by a preliminary article, as well as reaching 157 with this comment.

  • Shinoji

    Oh, damn. You’re absolutely right. Thanks for letting me know.

  • Heresy Hammer

    “Either way kudos to NG on getting all these comments out of the way by a preliminary article”
    No believe it or not this is the “calm” before the storm if you can believe that. Just kick back and watch the salt flow.

  • BaronKrause

    Where the hell did all these fanboy losers crawl the fuck out from?

  • RetroGamer

    Didn’t Banjo-Tooie have something similar in the dinosaur level?

  • Zero Eternity

    Should be very entertaining then.

  • Feniks

    Cool man. This is nichegamer, everyone here played games that scored a 6 or 7.

    I did not get upset when Lost oddysey got an 8 compared to FF13 that got a 10 in a magazine I subscribed to at the time.

    JE SUIS NICHEGAMER.COM

  • RetroGamer

    8.8 is actually higher than I would have scored TP. It was a disappointment to me, but then Skyward Sword was worse.

  • Eden

    Pointing out “problems” is a subjective thing. Those so called problems may not have been that bad to the reviewers to warrant lowering the score of the game.

    I saw many reviewers who would mention things like framerate and pop in and then proceed to say that it never actually ruined the game experience AT ALL.

    Docking points because of “problems” is something that would be based on the reviewer’s opinion and that’s why many of them still gave the game a 10/10. Horizon for example had problems that directly effected the enjoyment level of the game which is why it would get 8 or 9 from reviewers.

  • RetroGamer

    For me it depends what the actual score is. For those bothered by the frame rate and breaking weapons, I could see an 8 or 9 being reasonable. If it scores a 7, I’ll simply disagree and shrug it off. Below that and I’ll be part of the mob.

  • RetroGamer

    I hated Skyward Sword with a passion. It is by far the worst 3D Zelda I’ve played. The linearity…Urghhhh.

  • Tyrannikos

    Wow. Gerstmann didn’t seem to have a good time working with GameSpot, all things considered. I had never heard about this one before.

    Even so, I don’t really like the idea of NG reflexively defending themselves. It might be a personal hang-up, but it comes off as weak to me. If the reviewer really believes in the score they give a game then I don’t think justification is required (assuming the review itself matches the score given).

  • Eden

    The 1-10 score system works a lot like school:

    10 = A+
    9 = A
    8 = B
    7 = C
    6 = D
    5 (and below) = E

    I think many reviewers use scores on a “pro/con” bases, giving games a 7 or 6 just because it has some bugs or glitches that aren’t even game breaking and never actually ruin enjoyment.

    I heard reviewers talk about the empty world and then state that it never really bothered their enjoyment and therefore didn’t warrant docking off points, the same goes with framerate issues and the other things. The Horizon reviews were the same way, the game mainly got 8s and 9s because there were things that actually hindered the enjoyment of the game and the score was lowered because of it.

  • RetroGamer

    I’ve played every Zelda since the NES original and BOTW is one of my favorites. For me, TP and SS were the worst of the bunch.

  • Eden

    “fanboys” aren’t really the problem though. It should be expected that anyone who loves something is passionate about it, to just not care would simply mean you’re not a fan. I personally am not a huge fan of Zelda and therefore don’t really care about it, but at the same time, I don’t see how it’s just “impossible” that Zelda could be 10/10 worthy meanwhile, Overwatch is considered Game of the Year…

  • RetroGamer

    It’s a flaw sure enough, but not enough so to dock the game several points.

  • Godmars

    Only the real issue is that when a game is reviewed on a technical rather than subjective level, nevermind a clickbait level, the fan base of said game become zealously defensive of it. As in doxing and physical threats. Things have gotten that bad over “subjective” reviews which just also happen to effect meta scores, which then can effect a studio’s well-being.

    Nevermind all the other layer of BS that said same zealot fan base ignores like dev teams being overworked and exploited over those same games.

  • Zanard Bell

    To me, the numbered score system doesn’t really work anymore. Just a simple “Recommended”, “Wait” or “Ignore it” works already. That said, Nintendo people really want to get their 10’s, so I’m not surprised.

  • Zombie_Barioth

    Probably because 10/10 generally means “as close to perfect as possible” not that its absolutely flawless in every way, which is what a lot of people seem to think it means.

    It works the same was as in sport competitions, except reviewers rarely seem to give consistent scores. A lot of that would probably be because they have different reviewers most of the time. Its not like everybody at IGN would think BoTW is a 10/10 even if they all really liked the game.

  • Himegami Aisa

    If you’re excluding a 10/10 because perfection doesn’t exist, maybe you should rejig your scoring system. If you’re giving 9s to games that you think are absolutely the crême de la crême because you’re not confident it’s the Platonic fucking ideal of the genre, you’ve effectively reduced your 10-point scoring system to a 9-point one.

    You mention comparing to other games, but there’s a reason why outlets use large, discrete steps for scores: it’s supposed to give you a sense of its quality at a glance. If a game gets a 9, I can tell the reviewer thinks it’s a great game with goty potential, but not quite what they think would quality as the best game of all time/could be improved non-trivially/genre- or generation-defining/etc. Giving a game a 9.745 because if you pressed me I’d say it’s between this game I reviewed a month ago and this other one I played a few years is completely extraneous and doesn’t actually make the score more accurate.

  • CrusaderEsper

    People are fully welcome to have their own opinions. I’m just saying that a review several weeks after the game comes out is basically pointless. And docking a game 1-2 full points because it has framerate issues is kinda petty. So when they give the game a 7/10 because “muh frames” it just makes me think clickbait. When they give Yoshi’s Wooly World on the 3DS a 10 and other games with far less scope scores on the higher end, bombing a game like this just makes me lose confidence in the site and the reviewers.

  • CrusaderEsper

    I’m not sure how most people look at review scores and gaming websites, but I rarely use magazine/website reviews to recommend titles for me. I mostly look at reviews to see if said mag/site has similar tastes to mine, and only then do I make purchases based off of reviews. If a site has vastly different opinions from me, why return?

  • scemar

    I cringe to think people like this are supposedly big or influential names within the community because they self pretend to matter and enough idiots fall for it

    what a joke of a guy

  • AuraMaster DX (austin9568)
  • Zero Eternity

    You’ve got a point, my comment pretty much says there would be no higher than a 9.9. No game should reach my “platonic fucking ideal” because there is always something that can be improved upon in some way. Same with there will always be something that will detract from a game for somebody for some arbitrary moral or technical reason. I have never played a video game where everything was perfect and never will. But we’re now assigning different meaning to what 10 out of 10 means. For me 10 out of 10 doesn’t exist because it is perfect, no flaws, everybody in the world will love it with no complaints. For Zombie Barioth it is close to perfect as is possible. Wouldn’t 9.745 be the same thing? And of course it won’t make it more accurate. The whole rating of video games is skewed from person to person like my Dark Souls example. As shown by my comment and those below there are many different versions of the scale of 10 out 10 in regards to video games. Isn’t that interesting?

  • OldPalpy

    Leave then nobody will be crying over it. I don’t think this site or any other should be scared to give what they feel is their honest opinion about a game because it offends a publisher, dev or snowflake looking to white knight their game of choice.

  • OldPalpy

    Holy fuck “muh frames” now I’ve seen everything! Frame rate is one of the center pillars of any game that isn’t a visual novel, turn based RPG or a text adventure, I’d say part of the blame as to why frame rate issues plague so many modern games is because reviewers for whatever reason aren’t as critical towards them as they should be

  • Joe

    Nothing could be worse than Phantom hourglass… the stylus only controls just killed that game.

  • Joe

    Zelda fanboys are worst fanboys.

  • CrusaderEsper

    Maybe it’s because I grew up in a time when framerates in 3D games were always choppy and 15 fps was considered to be “good”, but unless a game has constant framerate issues, I don’t consider it to be a huge problem. Would I like it better if the game had a solid 60 fps all the time? Sure, but it isn’t a dealbreaker for me.

  • CrusaderEsper

    See, this is one of the reasons why numerical scores for games in general are so silly in the first place. When this site gives the game a 7/10, many people will write off the site as a clickbait site that is only fishing for more views. Hell, putting up a clickbait article saying “Hey guys, we’re going to review Zelda with a low score! No one freak out now!” worries me about the site’s future.

    Obviously the numerical score system is heavily entrenched across the industry and without having a score, your rating isn’t included in the metracritic aggregate scores. I would much prefer a three tiered rating system of “Recommend”, “Meh”, and “Avoid” with bullet points detailing why along with any caveats.

  • Izzy Lichi

    sorry but how exactly is the most non-niche title getting an article in niche gamer? thats like if nazi germany did an article about the jewish torah.

  • NintendoNaut

    Lol this video is the most pretentious thing I’ve ever seen, Zelda be darned.

    “If you gave this game anywhere near a ten, you are dishonest and should be scrutinized as a reviewer.”

    “Not many games these days are anywhere near 7.0”

    “Muh frames.”

    “All other outlets are lying to you.”

    “8.0 is too high.”

    Reviews are opinions, and basically what you’re saying is, “99% of all other outlets in the industry are lying to you and only WE hold the truth.”

    Can’t be serious.

  • Ruto-hime

    I really don’t care about any kind of number ratings, and shit. It’s just a terrible idea as a whole, but reviews and test still use this pointless system. (How relevant is a 10/10 rating scheme when their exist different variations of it like 100/100; 5/5 or good-bad…)

    But what does it matter, as long as I ignore them. You could give this game a triple S rating, and I still wouldn’t get it, even as a Zelda fanboy. :D
    Simple reason being, their decisions for the game. I’m not okay with to many of them to buy it now and at full price.

    Still, my interest in the technical side of the Wii U version still stands.

  • Izzy Lichi

    why is there an article about Zelda BOTW…..this is probably the last thing on earth right now, that should be considered niche………..

  • Izzy Lichi

    i gave it a 6/10 on my review site… giving it anything over that to me just reads that you are a zelda fanboy. the game has many tremendous flaws souly BECAUSE its a zelda game which it thinks it can get off scot free. ill give you one example. the story is absolutely terrible, cliche and overdone, buuuut since its zelda and link, its ok to do this? The durability system isnt bad but it isnt good either, my main problem with the durability system is that you dont get anything productive in return from using them, unless it’s to progress the story involving boss fights or scripted segments.. open world exploration is a complete joke in this game. the only reason to openly explore is for shrines and seeds… and seeds are hardly an incentive because despite it being one of the only other ways to gain somthing perminent, its just more inventory space :I

  • Izzy Lichi

    a Realistic grade for this game is a 6/10

  • bomblord

    I’m 70 hours in. I can count the number of times the framerate has notably dropped on my hands and the about 80% of those were in the Great Plateau. The wiiU version doesn’t fare so well though especially in villages.

  • KiTA

    Do the industry a favor. Stop using review scores. When asked, 10 out of 10, every game.

    Why? Because Metacritic is a cancer and when publishers started screwing some development studios over due to Metacritic scores (Obsidian, IIRC) the cancer became terminal.

  • CrusaderEsper

    You know, I posted my first comment on this after I read the text portion, but before I watched the video. After watching the video, I’m even more concerned. Saying that anyone that rated the game above a 7 should not be trusted and their integrity questioned really makes me wonder what’s going on.

  • Snorlaxation

    Not to be a fan-freak or anything, but I can’t imagine anyone giving this game an honest and in-depth review with a score that’s any lower than an 8, and even that’s pushing it for me. Personally I don’t know if I could give it an unbiased 10/10, because those shouldn’t ever be handed out without serious thought.

    Regarding the strong-arming of the weapon breaking system somewhat forcing you to play the game in certain ways (basically pushing the variety of other killing styles on you) is the only real issue I saw, and even then, it never truly got under my skin. Aside from that, some of the voice acting was not as good as it should’ve been. I’ve never been all that bothered by framerate drops unless they made the game look ugly or really got in the way, and neither of those is true of this game, but I’d still acknowledge the issue for the sake of others.

    Combined together, those issues are the reason I’d give it a 9/10 if I were being as objective as I could be. Subjectively, I love it, and would give it the full 10.

  • NintendoNaut

    Exactly lol — Opinions are one thing, and if NG wants to give the game a low score, whatever I guess. Don’t agree, but it’s their site.

    Thing that makes the video so insane is their, basically, blanket declaration that every single other outlet in the industry are liars and only NG is offering an objective look at the game. Insane.

    I also love that he says basically no game should ever receive a 10, and that most games these days are barely even 7s — And yet NG gave Yoshi’s Woolly Word a 10.

  • NintendoNaut

    This doesn’t have a lot to do with NG because they haven’t reviewed NieR: Automata yet and very well may slam it as well. But I’m playing both BotW and NieR side-by-side right now and am shocked at how well BotW performs, compared to how NieR does. NieR runs pretty well in most respects, but there are a lot of really nasty frame-time spikes that cause extremely noticeable stutter in many areas. It’s distracting and kind of off-putting because the game actually freezes/stutters for little milliseconds at a time.

    BotW has the occasional drop below 30FPS that makes you kind of go bleh — But the drops are always so brief and inconsequential I find them hardly distracting as I do NieR’s spikes. NieR is running on a PS4 Pro, while BotW is running on a glorified tablet. Just food for thought.

  • OldPalpy

    You’d much prefer sites like this not hurting the score aggregate of your precious game that’s more than obvious. Even if it was that tiered rating system it wouldn’t matter they’d still get hordes clambering at their gates about how triggered they are and still saying the site is fishing for views, it doesn’t matter if it doesn’t affect aggregate they’ll just invent another reason to justify it because they flat our hate having their narratives towards their purchase and hype commitment challenged.

  • Himegami Aisa

    That’s the most boggling analogy you could think up in this instance, not least because the Nazis made plenty of anti-semitic propaganda to justify treating Jews like dogs.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    Yeah after a week there’s no point in reviewing a game anymore! /s

    Also many reviews roasted Last Guardian, a genuine work of art, for occasionally bad framerates in certain areas. Glowing reviews, 7/10 scores.

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    Do you not understand the point of a ten-point grading system? What do you feel the point of such a system is, if anything below 7 is angry-mob worthy?

    When I was a kid growing up with GamePro, EGM, PSM, etc, games got bad scores all the time, in between the genuinely great games. But nowadays 6 or 7 = WORST POSSIBLE SHIT EVER, 1-5 generally serve no purpose in the grading scale, nobody is willing to outright slam a new release. And if they do, they will get attacked or accused of “clickbaiting”– just for having an opinion outside the majority!

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    I loved Phantom Hourglass, personally. I thought the Stylus controls would bother me but honestly I got sucked in and finished the whole thing. Great little title.

  • Just to note, the youtube comments vs site comments are amazingly different lol. Two things I have learned today from youtube commenters.

    “10/10 does not mean a game is perfect or close to it.”

    “Consistent frame rate drops are ok because its a Zelda game.”

    “A completely different game with no technical issues and runs at 30 fps lock on a old 3DS and 60 FPS locked on a New 3DS I gave a 10/10 to discredits a low score on a game on better hardware, frame rate drops to the 10-20FPS often, and control desync issues.”

  • NintendoNaut

    > “10/10 does not mean a game is perfect or close to it.”

    Well, that’s what *your* freaking review policy says dude lol:

    “The game is not necessarily the best game ever made, but it is decidedly one of the best in its genre. Usually, whatever the game does, it does better than most of its peers.”

    –NG Official Review Policy

    That’s pretty much exactly “10/10 does not mean a game is perfect or close to it.” — Just stating that it’s a prime example of its genre in excellence.

    Secondly, no one on the whole entire internet is saying “frame drops are okay because Zelda” — You are fabricating that statement and you know it. At least no one who isn’t being a purposeful troll. I don’t know what game you’re playing, but apparently it’s the same retail copy as mine. The game does not have “control desyncs” for me — Are you referring to the Joycon issue? That’s a hardware issue. Are you actually going to dock the game for a hardware issue? If you do, you will be the laughing stock of the internet, I assure you.

    Also, the claim that the game drops to “10-20FPS often” is completely false. Emphasis on *often* — The game does do it, but it’s not often. It’s seldom in high-density areas. For the record, it’s not excusable. A game that runs at 30-locked should run at 30FPS at all times. But in BotW I (and obviously most others) have not found it a very intrusive or immersion-breaking flaw.

    All that’s being said here, is that, in the video, you essentially say an 8 is too high for this game. You’ve already telegraphed you’re scoring it at 7 or below. And all I’m saying is that if you dock an otherwise masterfully crafted game for occasional frame drops and control issues you personally experienced due to faulty hardware, no one will take you seriously. Zelda or not.

  • If you think the game is “Masterfully crafted” you have already lost any respect I had for what you might say. Sorry its not and as stated on twitter it is one of the worst in the last 20 years.

    Also playing the full line up of Switch games, Zelda is the only one with a desync issue. Also the score has been reviewed by staff, and we all agree that the final score fits our experience with the game.

    As for the comment on the review policy, Not the best game ever, but one of the best and damn near perfect apply for the genre.

    And you have Nintendo in you user name, and you are trying to act like you are not fan boying over a real review.

    Please cry more.

  • RetroGamer

    I do know how — that’s why I would know an absurd and unreasonable score if I saw one. For a game of BOTW’s caliber, a 6 would be a terrible score. If you did a well-researched and well-written paper, would you be cool with a professor giving you a 60 on it?

  • stullz

    Wow… And I have lost the respect i may have had for you after that comment. Not very professional, and what I would expect more from someone trying to fan the flames. As for my Zelda experience BotW is my first full Zelda game and I consider it a 9. The gameplay is very well done with minor issues for me with the controls and combat system. I also have never experienced the desync issue (lucky me?). The world itself is incredibly well designed and feels lived in. Everything feels like it is there for a reason. I also love how nintendo is piecing the story together. So yes I feel this game is one of the best in its genre. (currently 80+ hrs in and loving it.) And for comparison I feel much the same way about Horizon, but because its controls feel better to me and I don’t see any real technical issues that take me out of the game I view it as a 9.5.

  • NintendoNaut

    >”If you think the game is ‘Masterfully crafted’ you have already lost any respect I had for what you might say. Sorry its not and as stated on twitter it is one of the worst in the last 20 years.”

    So basically telling me, again (just like in the video), that only your opinion is valid and yours alone. I’m not allowed to think (like the majority of the gaming community at the moment) that the game is wonderfully crafted. You realize you’re in the minority, right? If you don’t think the game is well-made that is absolutely fine by me — But what you’re saying is that anyone who thinks that is *wrong* and that’s insane.

    Also, I’m sorry that you had the desync issue but again — It doesn’t reflect the majority experience and surely you must realize this. Same thing with calling BotW the “one of the worst [Zeldas] in the last 20 years.” Extreme, EXTREME minority opinion.

    Your comment on your scoring policy is still hypocritical I’m not even sure what you’re getting at.

    Yes, my tag is @nintendonaut — I’ve had it since I was 12 lol. I do like Nintendo, but if you were actually reading my comments you’d know that my issue isn’t with you disliking the game. It’s with you making blanket statements and essentially paining NG as the only credible outlet on the title. Surely you must realize how insane this is.

    Also, very professional way of talking directly to your readers. Least you could do is be civil.

  • Snorlaxation
  • Snorlaxation

    I only started coming to NG around the time the notoriety ‘awards’ were being given out for game sites like last year or so.
    I assumed this site was more high brow, more focused, and definitely less bull-shitty than others i’ve been to. But seeing some of their other reviews now, and how they’re treating this particular one, I just don’t know what to think.

  • Snorlaxation

    the fact people tend to overlook though is where those positive reviews and critical acclaims are coming from. I’ve enjoyed pieces of Skyward Sword, but overall, it’s low on my zelda totem pole, and has been from the first day it came out. It’s true that depending on when you look at it, and when you play it, (maybe even going back later on for a second run through) can all influence your opinion, but unless you played absolutely drunk or high the first time, a year isn’t going to change much for those who were subjective (for the most part) from the beginning.

  • CrusaderEsper

    Did you watch the video? The comments the person in the video said made it clear that the intent is to fish for views. Why else call literally every other game reviewer in the world as unreliable with no integrity because they liked the game?

  • Funtime Happysnacks

    It’s a terrible score in your opinion. Because you would give it a higher score. It doesn’t invalidate their opinion if they give it a 6. The internet doesn’t mean we all meld into a hivemind (like some seem to think).

    As for your example, I don’t think anyone is going to gang up on a teacher over a bad score. You just suck it up and move on. You don’t need to defend Nintendo’s honor. They don’t know you. They don’t care.

  • CrusaderEsper

    So you’re throwing the entire review staff under the bus? I could understand one person with bad taste, but saying the entire site staff thinks that occasional framerate drops and a system related desync issue added with gameplay that your entire team apparently hates adds up to a 7/10 or lower for a game earning universal praise… well I guess you’ve piqued my interest and will get my click to see your full review to see if there is anyone at this site with an opinion in line with mine.

  • totenglocke

    Wow. This childish tantrum is definitely a “How the hell does this person have a job?!” material. Your opinion of the game is up to you, but blatantly insulting readers / customers and throwing a public temper tantrum would get you fired from the majority of companies.

  • OSad

    I actually think Jeff had a fine time working at Gamespot, or at least, it wasn’t any different than working at Giantbomb right up until he got fired for that Kane & Lynch review.

    He merged Giantbomb back into CBS so I sincerely doubt he had any hard feelings towards them. I think they even moved the office back into the same CBS-owned building that Gamespot uses. They work on different floors but share things like studio space for recording podcasts.

    I agree though, put out your review and trust your own assessment about the game without fear of backlash. Jeff Gerstmann certainly didn’t care about the score he gave TP and that guy’s his own boss now, so neither should you worry about BotW. This limp-wristed foreword just makes NG look bad.

  • OSad

    Really poor showing, Michael. Really poor.

  • Michael Richardson

    The author is already getting butthurt over some of the replies to his youtube videos.

  • GoT-Fan

    Is a reviewer actually egging on a commenter? That is a serious lack of professionalism right there.

  • Brimfyre

    Oh come on you guys are so full of shit.

    If just the one guy gave it a 7, that’s fine. Of course not everyone is going to love it. But the fact you said you all sat around and agreed together that this game didn’t deserve about a 7 is complete and total bullshit.

    Just say, “This is his opinion.” and move on. You don’t all have to be a hive mind.

    The game is fantastic. Anyone with a brain can see it is something amazing. The fact that not one single person on your team thought so, shows this review was just to spark a reaction, which I guess it did? but I also think you guys think you are more important than you really are. Only people who come to this site frequently realize what you scored it. It’s not going to give you the publicity that you think it will.

    You guys lost a ton of credibility on this one. Not that you were rolling in it before.