Worldwide Shipments for Final Fantasy XV Break 5 Million, Fastest-Selling Title in Series

final fantasy xv 03-31-15-1

Square Enix has announced worldwide shipments for Final Fantasy XV have topped five million copies.

This means the game is the fastest selling title in the entire series, including both physical and digital copies – with that milestone being hit on the first day of release.

To be clear, this figure is reported shipments for the game, meaning we don’t know exactly how many copies have been actually sold to consumers just yet. Square Enix, however, is saying this is the fastest selling game in the series.

Square Enix is going to continue developing post-launch DLC for the game, as well as other related projects.

Our thorough written / video review for Final Fantasy XV is forthcoming. For now, you can get our first impressions with an hour of footage here.

Editor’s Note: The article was originally worded a bit confusingly – it’s been amended for accuracy and clarification.


Brandon Orselli


Big Papa Overlord at Niche Gamer. Italian. Dad. Outlaw fighting for a better game industry. I also write about music, food, & beer. Also an IT guy.

  • Minuteworld92


  • Domhnall

    Wait, so did it ship 5 million units or did they sell 5 million copies to consumers? I’m confused by the wording.

  • Mr0303

    So the marketing machine worked pretty well. Plus FF fans just hoped for a game without Lightning.

  • Mr0303

    I guess those are the combined physical and digital sales.

  • Didney Worl

    After a decade long development Hell, I’m glad to see this story actually have a happy ending. I’ve been really enjoying the game so far.

  • Master Bating

    Muh graphics
    Muh brand
    Muh marketing

  • Grayares Fakcot


  • Ninjagai

    Because it doesn’t look like a ps2 game like every other jrpg. And it’s not a crappy shooter with dlc and microtransactions.

  • KissDisqus

    I’m amazed it did so well. I’ve read nothing but bashing on reddit,4chan,various gaming forums etc. Never any praise or hype in the past few months.

  • Daryl Corey

    ehh I liked Lightning mostly i just disliked the 20 hour corridor in XIII. Though Lightning returns did basicly utterly ruin any growth from XIII and XIII-2.

  • Daryl Corey

    Haters and Trolls are very loud I think most of the fans just started ignoring those places after a while, stopped posting and just went out and bought the game. Plus hating on FF is the cool thing to do it seems these days

  • KissDisqus

    That might be possible but even the ones who weren’t bashing the game weren’t exactly optimistic and were more just dreading another FFXIII tier screwup.

  • Narmy

    I’d honestly rather have Lightning than a boy band.

  • LibidinBoy

    “cant wait for this to flop, because of lack of waifus”

  • Daryl Corey

    FFXIII did sit wrong with alot of people. I enjoyed it but I will admit that 20 hour corridor and the lack of towns and such was rather annoying to me. Characters were not actually meaningfully worse than previous games people just seemed tired of those same character types in most every Final Fantasy since 7. So I can see where people might have some trepidation going into XV

  • Captain Vidya

    Now if only they could patch in an option to resize the display, as my TV does some stupid overscanning, so there’s HUD elements that are being cut off. Other than that, I’m having a blast.

  • Daryl Corey

    yeah same here I keep having like one letter on the far right cut off not really an issue but it does catch my eye every so often

  • Mr0303

    Be careful of what you wish for:

  • Daryl Corey

    Well Lightning was hot and by the end of XIII less of an emotionally stunted ice queen.

  • Daryl Corey

    Hmm cute Cat girl Lightning nice

  • Flamingfighter

    Ultimately 10 years of development hell doesn’t exactly inspire a lot of confidence in a game. Especially with games like Duke Nukem Forever existing.

  • chero666

    I seriously have to ask… are we too cynical?
    It’s easy to distrust, but… it looks fine. Everything I’ve seen about the game seems fine. So, what’s the main complaint I’ve been reading?
    “Boy Band” “Fujo-bait”
    … ok… it’s not like the series hasn’t been filled to the fucking brim with androgyny.

  • Bitterbear

    So.. How many copies does it need to sell to break even?

  • 2501

    So… when is Motomu Toriyama gonna get fired?

    At least this game has a fucking world map and being able to travel anywhere.

  • bell02

    the way you worded this news is just bad. Or you just copy/pastet it from a newsdump. The fact remains like this

  • Ganwi

    This should be a wake up call to all other developers.

    If you want your game to succeed, make the main protagonists look like…a gay boyband.

  • Androgyny does not mean waifu

    I couldn’t care less about Final Fantasy (haven’t done so since FF7), but it’s clear that the series has turned into a fujoshi shit-show, pandering to fangirls with their yaoi shipping dreams

    If you like that kind of thing then great, all the power to you

    But it would have been nice to have gotten a slight share of fan-service for male gamers in this game. The series is complete testosterone overload imo

  • BlueSkromanticies
  • magicalfollower

    R.I.P ATB/Turn-Based FFs…
    At least we have Persona/SMT for that.

  • True Goddess Reincarnation

    it has a season pass

  • bdp

    shipped sold a high number of digital copies but they don’t specify a number.

  • SunsetHaste

    Cid says hello as a share of fan-service.

  • Master Bating

    Maybe, just maybe, there are reasons as for why these “haters” talk shit about this game?

    Ever thought about that?

  • KissDisqus

    Is the game that much of a sausage fest? Only that blond chick with the other blond chick?

  • FrankieL

    While I do wish there were a couple of ladies joining the party, it’s not a deal breaker and I’m looking forward to my copy arriving today. Seems some people get too hung up on their expectations and preferences and can’t seem to try and enjoy something for what it actually is. Which is a shame really. Closed mindedness gets rather boring after a while.

  • Smug

    normalfag pls

  • Smug

    Still salty about folks shitting on the PS4?

  • Smug

    “Because it doesn’t look like a ps2 game like every other jrpg”


  • Master Bating

    The FF defense force is going down hard.

  • Smug

    >downgrades all the way compared to older gameplay trailers
    >press X to win
    >IRL products placements
    >delay the game one last time (after 10 years of development hell) “to prevent day 1 patch” but still went on adding it anyway

    if you have low standards in the first place of course you’re not going to see any issues and tell others you had “fun”

  • Longtooth

    I think I remember that they said that they would turn a small profit if 4 million is sold so maybe 3 million is where they would have broken even.

  • Master Bating

    What are you poor?
    I have three jobs, I swear.

  • Heresy Hammer

    “Square Enix is going to continue developing post-launch DLC for the game”

  • Smug

    “Having actual standards gets rather boring after a while.”
    ftfy faggot

  • Captain Vidya

    >and it doesn’t have DLC
    But… It does. And a season pass to boot.

    I’m being baited, aren’t I?

  • OSad

    Yeah, once Toriyama got mutinied off the helm, it’s not like it was going to be a disaster like XIII was. It’s just another Final Fantasy now but with a party of dudes, and not some weird fever dream you have when a thunderstorm with Lightning breaks out.

    I honestly don’t know why people were expecting it to flop. It’s like saying KH3 will flop, it’s impossible. The game will sell no matter what just because of its brand.

    The game looks cool in a weird way though, the intro to the game with the dudes pushing the car as a cover of stand by me plays in the back has got to be the most unironic, realest FF intro I’ve ever seen.

  • Longtooth

    I agree with you about the trolls and haters.
    Also there are the whiners who who can’t stop whining about the change in game play style. Those people need to accept their loss and move on.
    I don’t think that Final Fantasy is the cool thing to hate right now though. Every Final Fantasy has people complaining about it and claiming that the previous ones were better. People also argue about which of the previous Final Fantasy is the best one and those arguments get really dumb.

  • OSad

    >that poor snow-dressed roegadyn in the background who couldn’t join the shot because he didn’t pick Female in character creation

    So this is what gender segregation feels like…

  • Smug

    “Those people need to accept their loss and move on.”

    that’s we actually did, but what you fanboys cant
    we accepted Final Fantasy died when Sakaguchi left the team

    doesnt stop us however from mocking the parody the franchise has become

  • Kiryu

    It’s the current year,get with the times.

  • Captain Vidya

    I think he doesn’t want a unique artstyle that you can look back on in 10 years and still think that it looks good as opposed to the hundreds of “realistic” games that look exactly the same and will look like garbage when you go back and play them years from now.

    Besides, it’s not like the PS2 generation was one of the best generations of gaming or anything.

  • FrankieL

    See…. Now you wonder why gamers get a bad name when people like you go straight to being derogatory to other posters instead of having an actual discussion/debate. That’s the true sign of a weak minded person. Anyway, btw, everyone’s so called “standards” are different. In my opinion, being closed minded limits your standards and prevents it from growing and seeing other ways to tell a story. To me, judging by the way you replied to my comment, your so called “standards” seem to be quite shallow, which to me is boring. But that’s just from my perspective. Which everyone has a different perspective in life.

    See how I was able to get through an entire reply without slinging a single derogatory comment towards you? That’s called being an adult. Grow up.

  • LibidinBoy

    >only relatively fair argument
    >even niche review stated the combat is good in last demo review, not press x to win
    >this got to do with the company that made the game, not the product itself
    >same as before

    Just recognise you dont like the game cause its not neptunia. And im still waiting for your standard in games (“actual good games”, aka ecchi VN)

  • Kiryu

    Muh graphics.

  • Smug

    keep crying nigger

  • FrankieL

    Just leave. Get off the internet and exit society all together. You are what’s wrong with humanity.

  • Smug

    “being closed minded limits your standards”
    having shit taste limits your standards

    “seeing other ways to tell a story”

    “That’s called being an adult.”
    No, that’s called being a little bitch who cant handle banters. Man up faggot.

  • John Smith.

    So many salty tears to be found in the comment section over the lack of tits in this single videogame… it’s glorious to behold how low standards seems to have fallen for videogames if all that’s needed for a game to be considered good is a pair of animated boobs.

  • Dnetwork7

    And Trails/Kiseki!!!

  • FrankieL

    Oh, don’t get me wrong, I can handle it just fine. It just makes me realize how much of an uneducated imbecile you are where all you can do to state your side of the argument is to sling derogatory comments to people. Which btw, is not an actual valid argument. I can keep going on. But I feel the troll in you with the peanut sized brain can’t actually debate with valid reason without insulting someone for having a differing opinion. What else you got?

  • Smug

    Niggers, jews, chinese and muslims are what’s wrong with humanity

  • Smug

    “I can handle it just fine”
    If you did, you wouldnt cry like a little bitch about it

    >muh opinion
    >pls respect it no matter what
    hahahaha this isnt school anymore

  • FrankieL

    I’m not crying at all. I’m just waiting for something intelligent to come from you. I’m inviting you to actually have a discussion, but you can’t seem to even understand that.

  • FrankieL

    Wow… just wow.

  • Uncle Ocelot

    Looks like they’ll actually hit that 10 million goal.

  • Smug

    said the guy who cried about being fucked by vidya companies for their jewery but still blamed on pirates.

  • Uncle Ocelot

    Can you literally not even?

  • Travis Touchdown

    Shipped, not sold.

  • Travis Touchdown


  • Master Bating

    I can’t even…

  • Travis Touchdown

    All while Pokemon continues to sell over the next several years while FFXV sales drop like a rock…

  • Travis Touchdown

    No amount could really justify the amount of time they spent on it. There was a time when SE was internally working on this ONE project.

    The problem JUST isn’t that the game isn’t going to perform to expectations. The problem is that they don’t really have anything else to fall back on.

  • Uncle Ocelot

    It’s 2016!!!!!

  • FrankieL

    I can literally not even. ;P

  • Uncle Ocelot

    There are still spinoffs, like World of FF, but mainline games – yeah, they’ll be real time for a while now.

  • Smug

    dont worry I remember the 600 trillion too

  • It’s shipped copies, not sold. And people seem to forget one thing: Final Fantasy XV is the first title in the series to get a contemporary World Wide Release.

  • Jack Thompson

    I disapprove of your stance, but I agree with your vidya arguments.

  • Kiryu


  • Jack Thompson

    I know, this article is extremely misleading and should be edited.

  • Jack Thompson

    Does it? Or does it just have one large map for the road trip with the rest being linear for the story. That is, aside from the wilderness section, can I actually go everywhere, or is the world just like 13, but with a larger token open area near the beginning of the game rather than near the end?

  • Smug

    “I disapprove of your stance”
    wont probably take too long to change your mind assuming you are a yuropoor too

  • larverto365

    “Niggers and jews are what’s wrong with humanity”

    Dude what

  • To be fair, that’s Square Enix’s fault. They’re the ones who used the world sold only to later rectify. It’s slight marketing scumbuggery.

  • OSad

    Fuck you, here are my rig specs, I have so much more money than you that your argument is invalid

  • Dnetwork7

    tbh, that has always been the case. The west is only now getting Falcom’s best games in recent years.

    Cold Steel 2 may look like a ps2 game, but its still far superior to anything Square has put out in over a decade.

  • Tenith

    Do you mean that they sold that many to consumers or to stores? Be fucking clear.

  • Kiwi Hoy

    You should just assume that most of the commentors here are either severely autistic or trolls and ignore them regardless

  • Smug

    FFXV shill pls

  • Kiwi Hoy

    I mean the current in engine footage looks not only far better than the original gameplay trailer but pretty much better than the original CG trailer too so “>Downgrades” is total bollocks in any objective sense

    “Press X to win” common misconception held by people who havent played it but first of all, O is the attack button and second, enemies rarely stagger so you do actually have to dodge (also inb4 “phasing”, it works exactly the same as blocking in any action game only tied to mana instead of stamina, it’ll run out VERY quickly. Mana drains FAST)

    Product placement sure, no counterargument for that but honestly, is it that big of a deal? They had to get funding somewhere and its hardly big or intrusive

    And about the day 1 patch, the one they prevented was the typical day 1 patch in which it’s just a bunch of fixes for shit that was broken. They then went on to have ANOTHER one because they ADDED things to the game. Extra story content, quality of life features, etc. Essentially you’re bitching that they put extra effort that they had no obligation to into making the game the best it could be

    Any more misinformation?

  • Kiwi Hoy

    “Shill” is almost as meaningless a word as “cuck” or “SJW” on this site. Whenever it’s used it tends to mean “person I disagree with but can’t actually refute their argument”

  • I’ve been watching your posts for a long time, and I wanted to be fair with giving you a warning. If your behavior continues, I’m going to ban you.

    I absolutely hate tone policing, but your continual use of slurs and so on has made it very very difficult for me to keep a hands off approach to our comments and forums.

  • Smug

    but calling others “trolls and autistic” is fine tho? :^)

  • KissDisqus

    oh dear another string of replies involving Smug

    Bruh you’re arguing with a bot. It just uses buzzwords and copypaste comments from 4chan using an algorithm to find them through keywords based on the article title and threads.

    t.Smug creator

  • Apologies on the confusion with shipped vs. sold. Updated the article.

  • Narmy

    That’s a quick way to your site’s irrelevance. You don’t want to go down that road.

  • Smug

    RIP Smug
    Here died the little devil

  • Smug

    You know 4chan isnt the sole imageboard on the internet?

  • FlamableMind

    Yeah,uh,i think your forgot something in your post that this game was actually GRAPHICALLY DOWNGRADED even though it was in development for 10 YEARS.
    So enjoying something that was a stall project that was picked two years ago is something im surprised since theres so many SE fags that are going to pick this up even though FF died after IX.

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    People can ignore smug and never see his posts again. I don’t know why he needs a ban when you and your visitors can just put him on ignore.

  • dathip

    getting tired of Turn based anyway. With the exception of FF1, FF4, FF6, and FF7, and….FF9….and FF10

  • LibidinBoy

    lots of arguments, high-standards-guy

  • FlamableMind

    and Posting your warning on twitter helps alot lad.

  • Mr0303

    He’s desperately trying to be edgy.

  • hmmm?

  • FlamableMind
  • lalorobot
  • Yah what’s wrong with this. I was trying to poll more fans of the site for their input.

  • Smug

    Must be nice living in a peaceful neighborhood

  • FlamableMind

    If nomura was still working on this game it would have been better.

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    If you want some serious input, warn people to ignore him. This is internet 101. Ignore shitposters and trolls. It’s not difficult.

  • The thing is I’ve gotten people repeatedly asking me to warn or ban him for a long time :

  • Mr0303

    It is. You should stop being poor. All those dangerous jew gangs really are a problem.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    still salty about being poor and not being able to play video games?

  • Narmy

    The only people you should be banning are spam bots.

    Don’t you understand why people come to NicheGamer yet?

  • Warrior90

    Ignore them.
    If people need someone else to protect them from shitposters and trolls, and are too retarded to put them on their block list then that’s their own damn problem.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    are you salty?

  • OSad

    You have to run your own website, Brandon. A blanket advice that you, as a reader, have the power to ignore and downvote other users in the comments section who are bothering you is the sensible, impartial thing to do.

    Nobody needs policing in comment sections, the community is not run by children, we can do that ourselves. When you start banning people just based on “people” requests, that’s when you turn your community into twitter or facebook and I guarantee you, nobody who gives a damn about your website wants that.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    i actually have one. and im probably richer than you even if you have three jobs at once.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    the community indeed is run by children though.

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    Tough shit. Let them whine or just use the damn ignore feature like they should. Unless they’re all masochists and love the abuse. Fanboys offend me, you going to ban them too?

  • Smug

    “You should stop being poor.”
    guess then dealing with terror attacks/daily violence and (illegal) foreigners mean we frenchies are too poor :^)

  • LibidinBoy

    but calling someone on his shit I believe is not a bad thing to do.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    but you already said that when FF11 released….
    and FF12…
    and 14…
    oh wait…

  • OSad

    I’m willing to bet you’re one of the kiddies- oh, sorry… “people” who cried about smug hurting your feelings to daddy Brandon.

    It’s okay though, you have a lot of money to buy headphones so he should listen to you for sure.

  • Mr0303

    Are the Jews and the Chinese the illegal foreigners attacking France? No? Being edgy it is, then.

  • I’m going to call some anon “friends” to keep on messaging you to make me a mod.

    XOXO I hope you’re going to give me some magic golden flair with my promotion.

    No, but really, are you just going to go the way of the sensitive sites? Freedom of speech is easy to keep up with, especially when you can totally ignore those you don’t want to hear from.

  • FlamableMind

    Those people are probably autists that have no idea about the word ignore

  • Grayares Fakcot

    you know what?
    i bet my steam account is older than your existence .

  • FrankieL

    ^This. I’m getting tired of “looking the other way” when someone is being crappy to another person for absolutely no reason. And “looking the other way” or ignoring doesn’t do anything to help the gaming community evolve to be better human beings. But that’s just me.

  • Jack Thompson

    No problem mang

  • Narmy

    It’s not just you. It’s all the SJW pieces of shit that have ruined half the internet too. There are plenty of sites you can visit instead if you want a safe space.

  • FlamableMind

    Because if it was on a nintendo console it would have been a huge h- oh wait barely anyone owns a wii u so i guess NOT

  • FlamableMind
  • I’m fine with the boy band, but if you’re going to give me an action based game don’t make it all QTEs with pseudo-tab targeting and slow combat.

  • OH FFS. Now Squeenix America is saying “shipment and digital sales exceed five million”


  • Mr0303

    They are just trolling for kek’s sake.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    for the record, square enix never release actual sales figure. only shipments

  • Hahahahaha!

    It probably means they shipped 5.1m and sold 10k out of all of those.

  • LibidinBoy

    I hope you apreciate the irony of your response.

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    Grow some thicker skin.

  • The combat, which makes most of the game, is garbage.

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    He’s a bigger troll than Smug. Incredibly limp-dicked internet tough guy.

  • FrankieL

    From the perspective of SE, anything “shipped” is still sold when looking at the books. Product is out of their warehouse and into another company’s. So it could be that they sold the copies they shipped. Doesn’t mean sold through to the consumers though. So… yeah.

  • catazxy

    So now we can expect more ff like this….I don’t know if its a good of a bad thing, since I won’t play this game, but there you go…

  • Grayares Fakcot

    *won’t be able to

  • Riosine

    I thought you actually were tired about smug repetitive behaviour, and not just acting under some kind of social presure. You should be yourself and not pander to anyone as the admin. of your site.

    Althought Smug can be really obnoxious sometimes.
    other people can reason with him or just ignore him and move on.

    If there would be some kind of ethical reason to ban him, then It would be if someone could actually demonstrate that Smug interactiions on Nichegamer are detrimental to his own self and that is in a path to commit suicide.
    That would be very hard thought, So sorry if my advice/hint is sort of useless

  • End thyself.

    Here’s an answer to your supposed argument. No one has any obligation to “enjoy something for what it is”, you’re outright lucky games and in general, art, can’t be deemed “bad” or “good” in an objective manner, otherwise I’d tell you to enjoy cancer for what it is, aka deadly and incurable.

  • FrankieL

    I have quite the thick skin. It’s extremely hard to offend me, but when someone provokes me, I’m not gonna just let shitty behavior towards other people slide. I will call them out on their BS and calls it likes I sees it.

  • FlamableMind

    The only good guy with good opinions on this site.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    dont go away i love u

  • Choppinfoot

    What’s scarier is that FFXV is actually quite good. I didn’t think Square had it in them after making two more FFXIII games.

  • Did you outright admit you don’t know basic economics?

  • Grayares Fakcot

    thats exactly what happens. it’s SE “selling” (read: shipping) to the retailers.

  • AKA not getting their money back, AKA the crux of your whole shill tirade.

    If their disks rot in a warehouse, that’s not earned money.

  • FrankieL

    No, I admitted to ignorance of the logistics of Publisher->Store->Consumer sales. I simply gave a possibility of what SE means.

  • OSad

    Mate, no offense, you seem like an eloquent person, but you are not the one who’s got the right to dictate how communities should evolve and should be run, nor should anybody have the right to do that besides the website’s creators, and even then, they risk alienating their communities. A lot of readers on this website come here *specifically* to avoid this sort of tone policing.

    You want to “help the gaming community evolve to be better human beings”? How did you arbitrarily decide that most of the gaming community is below your standards? You already have the tools to make the community what you want: ignore and downvote the posters you don’t like. You have that individual power for yourself. You can also create your own news website and moderate it however you want.

    You can call people out on their shit. Expect a reply back if that person has a backbone to defend his positions. But when you try to get people banned because you don’t like them, then you show without a shadow of a doubt that you don’t have any backbone to be around here, regardless of how many times you say you do.

  • It’s been an ongoing debate with myself as to where I decide what’s best for the site myself, and what lots of users ask for, etc… it’s tough. It’s kind of grown beyond anything I ever expected and TBH, ultimately, I revel in how open and crazy it gets sometimes.

    After seeing all the responses I’m just mulling it over again.

  • I want you to try and tell those people about the ignore function first, before you decide anything else.

    Although, I’m that guy that would also tell them they’d lose all the fun if they use the functiom

  • Master Bating

    “I actually have one”
    I don’t give a shit about MCDonalds

  • Grayares Fakcot

    im against banning anyone but spammers.
    just so you know

    not everybody hates arguing.
    i for one loves arguing and getting trolled/trolling

  • Or it’s really half truths to get more sales. Despite bandwagons being retarded (e.g. see NMS’s sales), people still follow and buy or try themselves.

  • Smug

    “art, can’t be deemed “bad” or “good” in an objective manner”
    for the umpteenth time, taste is subjective but quality and artistic merit is not as there are viable objectively based criteria to evaluate them (composition and structure, subject matter, details, color theory, mastery of fundemental techniques, innovation/ingenuity, etc.)

    what you’re spouting is typical from a pleb who relies on the assumption that “art can be anything” and that all art is equal in artistic merit.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    anything can be art though

    art is arbitrary

  • “but quality and artistic merit is not ”

    An argument to end them all.

    Prove it.

  • Jack Thompson

    You mean 4.9?

  • Smug

    ill always be ur big girl

  • No, they shipped and sold over 5m, so it’s really shipped + 1 and at least one sale.

  • What argument?

  • Master Bating

    I’ll be your robot bby

  • Smug

    screw me

  • Smug

    but you admit nigs and muslims are a problem then

  • Master Bating

    Back to Tumblr with you

  • Master Bating


  • Kiwi Hoy

    In this instance none but in any other instance, the argument presented

  • Smug
  • Master Bating

    The story is garbage, the Open World is garbage, the combat is flashy but has no depth much like Warner Bros games.
    It has nice graphics


  • No, they’re not even part of the same art movement.

    Was that it? Better than I thought, at least this time you used examples.

    Come on, continue. Show me how these two can be compared and show exactly how one of them is either low quality or isn’t (or both).

    Clearly, if it’s objective, you can do that.

    Oh and artistic merit, right…

  • Ubrokemygrill?

    By removing them from the discussion entirely? These are just words on the internet. If people are THAT fucking offended by smug’s words, maybe they really should take his advice and off themselves.

  • Zero Eternity

    I kind of find it funny you have had people ask you to ban him when they already have the option to block him themselves. It just makes it sound like the askers were sore losers in an internet argument of all things.

  • Every other which instant? You guys are idiots there too, that doesn’t change.

    Are you even aware the subject of this argument or…?

  • FrankieL

    Oh, you’ve got me wrong. I don’t think a ban is in order at all. Just an eye opening to shitty behavior and the refusal to just let it slide is all. And I don’t think my personal views towards others should influence or dictate towards Brandon to take action on his website. It’s his thing and I respect that. As far as ignoring and downvoting… That does absolutely nothing to help the problems that the gaming community faces. The questions we all should be asking ourselves is this: Do we want to foster the kinds of comments that Smug has put out repeatedly? Or do we want to let people like him know that that kind of behavior is unacceptable and doesn’t contribute to discussions in any positive way? I’m all for differing opinions, but when comments don’t actually contribute and only seek to divide and provoke, that’s where it gets to the point where something needs to be at least mentioned. If someone wants to be racist or just a general dick to others, that’s their deal, but don’t expect people to just lay down and accept it. If you’re being a dick just to be a dick where it is completely unprovoked, I’m gonna let you know. If you want to continue being a dick, that’s your decision. At that point, I will ignore you and move on with my life. As I have done already with Smug. I tried to have an actual discussion with him, but he seemed unable to do so. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

  • FrankieL

    Never asked to ban him or remove him from the “discussion”. There was never any discussion to begin with when trying to talk to him, just and fyi.

  • If only the combat did look flashy… I actually like flashy.

  • FrankieL

    I agree.

  • tccboss

    Welp so long traditional fantasy and sci fi ff games.

  • Mr0303

    I just pointed out that you were trying to be edgy.

  • FrankieL

    Very well could be. We shall soon see the longevity of actual sales in the weeks and months to come. We do know however, that any digital sales are actual true consumer sales. So there’s that. We just don’t know how much of the 5 million were digital. Going by EA’s digital sales number they recently released, it could be safe to say that it could be upwards around 50% were digital sales.

  • larverto365

    Are you saying that all black people are murderers? If so, then by that logic, Colin Powell caused 9/11.

  • At least use “preorders”, not digital sales, I almost called you an idiot.

    Digital sales are bought data, not ordered physical copies (or at least most of the gaming world uses those words that way). They don’t cap digital sales so they’ll never claim “5m shipped” anyway.

  • Smug

    >not knowing the “crabs in the bucket” mentality

    Ever heard of the “uncle sam” slur for instance? Nigs absolutely hate blacks who improve themselves

  • OSad

    One of them shows a firm grasp on shapes and forms, shadows and colors, human anatomy and scene composition. These are all things that take a long time to master and make the quality of the piece unquestionable, even if you don’t like what it presents itself.

    The other one is quite a lot harder to judge fairly, because it looks like a drawing an art student made for their OC character in a DnD game. The lines look gross and scribbled, it lacks the use of proper light and dark in areas which would give the painting depth, the anatomy makes the body in the image look like a mix between frankenstein, an orc and an anime girl, the colors are flat and washed out…

    Objectively, the first one is a better, more pleasing painting from a technical standpoint. The second one looks like it could have been made by anybody after a few minutes. The artist behind it could either be a guy who has the same fundamentals that the one who did the first painting, yet chose to create a stylized (so to say) piece like this, or this could be his style, or he could be an artistically inept person. Regardless of the art movement though, you can clearly see that the first one has had more time and effort put into it, so it objectively deserves more merit than the second one.

    I mean, this is such a no-brainer. It’s like comparing Mona Lisa to the shape of a triangle. You can go on all you like about how the triangle is more beautiful to you since it has no wasted edges and it fits perfectly in the frame, and all the more power to you if you can do that, but at the end of the day, the Mona Lisa will always trump in actual technical prowess, because it required its artist to actually know what the fuck he was doing.

  • FrankieL

    Other than saying “End thyself”, you make a very valid point. To counter that, though, I’d say informed opinion can only be validated if only one actually experienced the content to make that opinion. That’s why I said that expectations and preferences only go so far to form an opinion. Many people seem to form an opinion and refuse to even try something. It’s automatically garbage to them. I feel that’s a bit shortsighted and just a shame because you never know… you might actually like it if you try it. That’s all I was saying.

  • “and make the quality of the piece unquestionable”

    Yeah, I just questioned it. Oops.

    “One of them shows a firm grasp on shapes and forms, shadows and colors, human anatomy and scene composition.”

    And why is that “objective quality”? Van Gogh clearly doesn’t know how to draw stars for shit, so his art is objectively bad.

    “These are all things that take a long time to master”

    So does sneezing and farting at the same time with your eyes open.

    “more time and effort put into it”

    I’d say it’s harder to catch farts in bottles, so clearly both pieces are shit.

  • FrankieL

    Ah… But I think it actually depends on the artist’s goal. If you’re basing superiority objectively on realism, then yes, the first is the better piece. But if you’re basing superiority on the emotion the pieces represent, one could argue that the second one is the better piece. That’s the wonderful thing about art, is that it’s all in the eye of the beholder and there is no wrong answer.

  • OSad

    >The questions we all should be asking ourselves is this
    >Do we want to
    >Or do we want to
    >but don’t expect people

    Why don’t you change all of those “we” ‘s and “people” to “I” and “Me”?

    You are free to call other people out to on whatever you feel is unacceptable to your own moral code. Just don’t do anything in the name of other people, because I want nothing to do with it, and you can’t expect other people to want the same thing as you do either. I can think for myself without your help, thanks.

  • LibidinBoy

    Im against the ban hammer
    Im pro calling on people’s shit when there’s too much bs

  • So he is another of the foolish Corporate Slaves that believe in the pirate bogey man.

  • FrankieL

    But digital sales are actual hard numbers that can be considered sales. Those numbers can easily be determined. Store sales numbers are a bit tougher to pin down as you have to actually get in contact with the vendors to provide the hard data. So SE can only go by shipped numbers and digital sales at this point in time. Pre-orders might be able to be used, but I still don’t think they could be completely accurate as pre-order numbers have to actually match shipped to consumer numbers. Which would still take a bit of time to determine.

    So yeah. Their number is ambiguous from the shipped number stand point. But digital is true because there was nothing that needed to be shipped and went straight to the consumers’ systems to play.

  • FrankieL

    ^ I agree with this.

  • FrankieL

    Fair enough. If you’re cool with it, that’s your thing. ^.^

  • “I’d say informed opinion can only be validated if only one actually experienced the content to make that opinion. ”

    “Validation” is irrelevant if you can’t reach a conclusion. Also, your use of “validation” is arbitrary.

    This is why you don’t mix up shit.

    It’s easy, yours is not an universal anyway, which was my point. Trying it out also costs me.

    So, sad or not, I could as well make an informed decision on my likes and dislikes by only seeing the fucking thing.

  • Smug

    “But if you’re basing superiority on the emotion the pieces represent, one could argue that the second one is the better piece”

    aka “I bullshit my way in by making some social commentary that my university professor will approve, in order to hide the fact I have no talent”

    “That’s the wonderful thing about art, is that it’s all in the eye of the beholder and there is no wrong answer”.

    For someone who claims himself to be an adult, you sure believe in this childish assumption of “all art is equal in artistic merit/anything can be art” (which has been memed by school/media since it’s easier to make garbage than admit you need talent and years of practise to make good work)

    I also bet you’re on of those idiots from Deviantart (or whatever social website) who shield themselves behind ITS MY STYLE excuse against criticism because no actual artist will take your scribbles (or whatever smeared shit) seriously.

  • Read what I said again.

    TL;DR digital sales have nothing to do with this article.

  • Uncle Slick


    RIGHT GUYS?!?!

  • Uncle Slick

    I would love you if you did.

    Smug is actual cancer.

  • Please don’t make this site into a censorship happy site like gematsu. gematsu is cancer enough.

  • Uncle Slick

    “For someone who claims himself to be an adult”

    Dude, you’re AT MOST 16.

  • Grayares Fakcot

    are you salty?

  • Jack Thompson

    This is digital sales plus shipped copies. Even Squeenix had to redact their previous statement where they lied about it being total sales. Not to mention the number of copies ship is only this massive for the first time, because this is the first FF worldwide release, as opposed to releasing regionally at separate times. We know nothing yet.

  • Smug
  • Uncle Slick

    You don’t even know what that word means.

  • OSad

    >Yeah, I just questioned it. Oops.

    I mean… great.

    Draw a better piece if you want to put words into action, or give some actual reasons as to why you think his skill is bogus. Otherwise, you can “question” the artistic prowess of the man all you want.

    >And why is that “objective quality”?

    Because it takes a long time to master and it represents reality accurately, mate. Anybody who’s had art classes for a period of time knows how hard it is to draw fruit or a bottle of wine, let alone three ladies on three different poses on three different planes in the scene, and the rabbit hole goes down from there.

    >Van Gogh clearly doesn’t know how to draw stars for shit, so his art is objectively bad.

    Actually, Van Gogh could clearly draw some beautiful landscapes which demonstrated a mastery of shadows and depth perception in a scene. He faltered in everything else, but he had artistic merit.

    And that’s how you see stars in the night sky too, or how you would if there wasn’t that much light pollution in the scene. The moon would be the biggest object in the sky, then all the other stars would be similar dots spread across said sky. The lighting is stylized but this is not because he does not know how to do lighting, as evidenced by the weaker lights on the houses down below, but because he wanted to put an emphasis on the stars on this piece. He also had to know to paint fast, since the sky moves, the elements in the scene would also be moving, so he needed to have a mastery of his tools to represent the sky how he wanted it before it shifted completely.

    >So does sneezing and farting at the same time with your eyes open.


    >I’d say it’s harder to catch farts in bottles, so clearly both pieces are shit.

    You can’t draw or paint anything with a fart in a bottle. You can smell it and get really high though.

  • FrankieL

    Not at all. All art should be constructively criticized. You misunderstand. Not all art is equal through one pair of eyes. Just as not all art is equal through another pair of eyes. That’s my point. Different people find different qualities in art. Art evokes different responses from different people. What you may find disgusting, another might find it beautiful. That’s why there’s no way to truly judge art objectively. It’s absolutely impossible. Can art be considered amateurish, sure can. A true artist is always striving to perfect their craft and is able to take criticism. Have an artist stand next to one of their pieces and listen to people judge it, the artist is going to find that there may not be one sole judgement whether it’s bad or good. The artist will get a huge range of opinions on the piece. Therefore the piece is neither bad or good. It just is.

  • Smug

    if I wanted to play video games, I wouldnt buy a PS4

  • Their trying to make this site into another gematsu. Get people that don’t share your opinions banned so they can have their safe space.

  • It can’t be objectively good either.

  • Oh the irony.

  • Chris Mendivil

    I wonder if people who wanted the game to sell poorly will get salty about it being sucessfull?

  • Smug

    Which was my point from earlier
    Taste is SUBJECTIVE
    Artistic merit/quality is OBJECTIVE (with the criterias)

    “That’s why there’s no way to truly judge art objectively. It’s absolutely impossible.”
    you should consider killing yourself for being such a plebian

  • Jack Thompson

    We don’t know if it’s successful yet.

  • FrankieL

    But artistic merit/quality is also absolutely subjective in of itself. Technical merit/quality on the other hand can absolutely be objective.

  • Smug

    and you cant into reading comprehension either great

  • “Draw a better piece ”

    Not an argument.

    “Because it takes a long time to master”

    >So does sneezing and farting at the same time with your eyes open.

    “and it represents reality accurately, mate. ”

    Van Gogh is shit.

    “Actually, Van Gogh could clearly draw some beautiful landscapes which demonstrated a mastery of shadows and depth perception in a scene.”

    I clearly see some “ugly” blobs of something, all mastery all right.

    When will you demonstrate hat Van Gogh’s works are of quality?

  • FrankieL

    What part did I not comprehend?

  • OSad

    Honestly, you shouldn’t have apologized the first time you corrected the article. The original title was accurate, “5 million copies shipped” *was* accurate, the quote from Square Enix of 5 million sold is the one that might’ve been right or wrong, but you were just relaying it on the article. The “mistake” wasn’t really your fault on this one.

    It’s just a comment since this is a mess no matter how you look at it, but maybe an update like “Square Enix has declared they’ve sold 5 million copies, however, it isn’t clear if this means copies sold or copies shipped. We have reached out to Square Enix for comment and will keep you guys updated.” was what you actually should have done originally.

  • FrankieL

    Balance, rhythm and composition overall. Art isn’t just about style and realistic representation. Many people get tripped up on that.

  • Jack Thompson

    Smug should not be banned and neither should the people who disagree with him, despite me thinking they’re retarded. I personally approve of the removal of total shitposting when a discussion becomes nothing but a dozen or so comments with nothing but name-calling. Smug does go there sometimes. As long as there is an argument from either side though, derogatory terms should not be grounds for a ban.

  • FrankieL

    “This means the game is the fastest selling title in the entire series, including both physical and digital copies – with that milestone being hit on the first day of release.”

    But they do. Says it right there in the article above.

  • OSad

    >Not an argument.

    I’ve given you plenty of reasons as to why I think it’s a better piece though. And it’s not an argument to say “They’re not even part of the same art movement.” either because that implies that I can’t judge both pieces equally because they don’t belong on the same medium, when that isn’t true, I absolutely can.

    >Van Gogh is shit.

    So is youre waifu

    >I clearly see some “ugly” blobs of something, all mastery all right.

    When you look at a circle but want to see a square instead, I guess you can say anything is ugly in your eyes.

    >When will you demonstrate hat Van Gogh’s works are of quality?

    I’m not The Gogh, I don’t have to sell you on his paintings. His paintings are out there on the internet, you can look for yourself. You said he draws stars like shit and I disagree, and I explained why I think they look fine from a technical standpoint.

  • Even if you don’t trip there, no matter how much you try, you can’t demonstrate “quality”.

    He’s (oSad) already starting to narrow it down (I wonder if he’ll actually compare same art movement one of these days) but it’s still arbitrary. It seems Van Gogh mastered shadows but he can’t master realistic representation, tough luck, Van Gogh, I guess you’re half-shit now.

    In the end, it all narrows down exactly to personal preference. Which is why you we’re correct partially, but wrong on acting as if that wasn’t the case.

  • Chris Mendivil

    What would have to happen for this game to not be sucessfull?

  • I don’t care why you think something, I clearly said I want irrefutable proof on how that art piece is of quality.

    You said mastery time matters and I demonstrated it doesn’t. You said it’s what they mastered, and I demonstrated they didn’t “master” other aspects (so pls explainerino hoto no arbitrary pls) in your own definition. You’re also comparing dinosaur to rock and then you cry you can’t get this argument going (same art movement pls, then demonstrate why I need to listen to art movements).

    Sheesh, nigga.

  • Smug

    stop being such a tsundere

  • It’s called a failed edit. That clearly says “sales” when we’re talking “shipments”, double fail that it also uses “shipment” and “digital” in the same place.

    Brandon said as much.

  • FrankieL

    But that’s the problem… “quality” is subjective in of itself too. The only time “quality” can be objective is in the technical realm. Never in the artistic realm.

  • FrankieL

    So, what are we arguing about again? lol :P

  • OSad

    This could go on all night and I don’t want to anymore.

    You win, art is subjective and there is no such thing as objective quality. Van Gogh is shit. Farting in bottles trumps all paintings.

    Have a good evening.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    “To be clear, this figure is reported shipments for the game, meaning we
    don’t know exactly how many copies have been actually sold to consumers
    just yet. Square Enix, however, is saying this is the fastest selling
    game in the series”
    SquareEnix: Act without thinking

  • OSad

    PS: youre waifu still a shit

  • It’s all in my posts.

  • porkbun

    Maybe Falcom from 5~10 years ago but not the one right now.

  • No. Shit.

    Artistic quality is subjective, that’s what I said.

    If what defines quality is objective then so is quality…

  • Zero Eternity

    Do you know what is that from?

  • porkbun

    And they don’t have much presence in the story. It’s a sausage fest alright.

  • Heh.

  • FrankieL

    You just contradicted yourself. Do you actually know what the difference between “subjective” and “objective” is?

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Those have been gone for a decade plus. Stahp it.

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Shipped means sold to retailers. Square has their money. They’re Guuci.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    I was expecting it to flop in the way that it doesn’t make back what they spent on it no matter how well it sold.

  • Customer sales needed don’t take into consideration retailer shipments, otherwise we’d always have sequels.

  • Master Bating

    No, but you probably are though considering you’re at the frier all day

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    Hear hear!

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    ATB’s time has come and gone. If you want that get a handheld and call it a day. I didn’t buy a console or build a high end PC to simply go through with walls of text and “Select ‘Magic’, use ‘Firaga’, 457 DMG” Games have to grow. And there are literally hundreds if no thousands of JRPGs that still have Turned Based combat. Get over it.

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Its actually filed with shit to do and the story doesn’t cuff you to it like a lot of RPGs.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    The same can be said against the change but without the ability to say you were there first.

  • I’m sorry if semantics are hard for you, bro. It’s pretty easy though, try adhering to the context present.

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    The game has been out for just over 48 hours and people in the comments are pretending to wonder if it will break even with 5 million shipped.

    Nichegamer, never change.

  • Shirobako.

  • Anon_Amous

    What kind of blows my mind is that this game is very comparable to Xenoblade X, which don’t get me wrong is great, I love both these games… But Xenoblade X took like less than 1/3rd the time this did. :P

  • Malcolm_Ecks
  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    You’re crazy, this is how people see Square:

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    Has any of their recent games sold up to their expectations?

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Xenoblade X also didn’t get completely reworked. Its also a much, much smaller map and Xenoblade X isn’t about having populated areas.

  • Zero Eternity

    Thank you.

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    FF14 is likely going to be the top sub based MMO next year. World of Final Fantasy sold better than expected. As did the episodic Hitman. Pretty sure the new Dues Ex game met expectations as well.

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Not even close man.

  • Jack Thompson

    Not enough sales, too many returns.

  • Alistair

    That pretty good going for a game of gay men. That regression loves so much.

    I never like change for good or worse.

    The saying if it not broken don’t bloody fix it.

    The fact it did sold well has saved SE from going under as they took the risk of saying if it doesn’t sold well it be the end of SE.

  • Adohleas

    When I saw the title before clicking the link, I thought the exact same thing. I will miss ATB/Turn-Based FFs. Here’s to hope that Edge of Eternity fills in part of that gap missing from the FF series.

  • Smug
  • magicalfollower

    The gameplay mechanics, speaking quality-wise, are totally questionable since it’s a matter of preference. Afterall action-based and turn-based games are completely different game-types. Maybe you didn’t buy a console/PC to play such games(turn-based), but other people certainly did.

    Also I never said there were few turn-based JRPG games.

    Anyway, as long i have my SMT/Persona/Kiseki for that niche i’m good.

  • Mr0303

    What does this have to do with anything that was said above?

  • Narmy

    That doesn’t even make any sense.

  • Tyrone Jackson

    It’ll see boosts when it hits other platforms, but overall FFXIV is as “Twitch overhype game of the week” as it gets.

  • Tyrone Jackson

    Yeah the whole Gayrod Squad thing is the #1 reason the game isn’t remotely on my radar.

  • Choppinfoot

    Once again, in English this time?

  • Smug

    “Games have to grow”

    Mature games for mature gamers such as myself

  • Choppinfoot

    Granted, I’m only 6 hours in, but there’s no homoerotic undertones yet, apart from maybe that twink Prompto.

    It mostly just feels like an adventure with the lads; camaraderie rather than supposed sexual tension.

  • Jack Thompson

    Pretty sure Alistair is a non-native English speaker. Cut some slack.

  • Chris Mendivil

    How likely does that seem right now?

  • AR7777
  • AR7777

    No FF5 on that list??

  • Jack Thompson

    Hard to tell, game just came out.

  • No problem, nigga.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    I wonder if he got fired from the NSA yet.

  • Chris Mendivil

    There are some things we already know though. Gameplay demos have been widely available for quite some time, some of the people who played them reserved a copy at their local retailers, and retailes asked for 5,000,000 units based in part on those reserve numbers.

    tl;dr? 5,000,000 units shipped because we asked for it. As far as my opinion of the game, it’s what I expected and I’m enjoying it.

  • Didn’t FF14 fail the first time?

  • Only in the AAA world man.

  • What do you mean?

  • Jack Thompson

    Yep, and thus A Realm Reborn was made to cover for their incompetence.

  • No censorship is cancer.

  • Now you called him out on his BS. He will block you like he blocked me.

  • Jack Thompson

    It’s not acting without thinking, it’s shady marketing to create the illusion of success before it’s happened. The average consumer nowadays only cares whether a game is successful as a measure of quality nowadays, not quality itself.

  • RetroGamer

    Now they’ll see that not censoring Cindy’s boobs was the correct decision.

  • Uncle Slick

    No censorship is cancer?

    Dude, ALL censorship is cancer!

  • Malcolm_Ecks

    Yes it did. But that was because it was legit a pile of garbage. For them to bring it to a point of overtaking WoW by summer next year is a fucking impressive feat. Considering every other Sub based MMO went Free 2 Play, to be WoW’s only close competitor is a very impressive feat. And its a legit critically acclaimed MMO.

  • Kengofu

    Reading through this comment section was outstanding. There was intrigue, drama, the same weebisms like “fujoshi” being thrown around, an argument on whether or not to ban that dipshit Smug as if the block button doesn’t exist for anyone who chooses to use it, discussions with the staff, complaints about the game’s gameplay from people who’ve never played it past, at most, a single, incomplete and surprisingly non-representative demo, and very little actual sales talk or figure estimations. Man, GamerGate really fucked you guys up, huh? Solid comment section, would absolutely recommend.

  • Jack Thompson

    >non-representative demo
    What’s the point of the demo then? Isn’t that just another failure on Squeenix’s part? What the hell does GG have to do with this? You trying to D&C?

  • Jack Thompson

    Did somebody say CLANG?

  • Kengofu

    I’ve been saying for over a year that Square has no clue how to demo their product. That was a huge failure on their part. I’ve been pretty open about that sentiment too. And GG has nothing to do with this directly, what I’m saying is, post GG, so much has changed about these smaller, non-shill, actual games journalism site communities and in such a rabidly hostile way. It either became initially flooded with moronic SJW weebs who heard about them for the first time, like Siliconera or the communities, full of “free speech advocate” weebs (I.E. I say faggot, retard and nigger a lot, lmao Trump Rulz!) that are just straight up anoying.

  • Jack Thompson

    I prefer the latter, but it’s definitely not all of Nichegamer, or even true for this comment section. I see arguments common from both sides, as well as plenty of neutrals too. That’s not to say these are 100% indicative of which group someone would be categorized into, but that it’s definitely not a one or the other thing.

    Also, Trumpfags are delusional. Never trust a politician. Though I do believe he’s the lesser evil this election.

  • Kengofu

    Oh, I’d never propose that all the newcomers or people in the comments section are a monolith, mind you. I agree that each of these people are individuals and broad strokes as opposed to a case by case critical eye is simply not conducive towards reasonable discussion. What I have said- what I’ve always said, is that while I am a fervent supporter of GG, just because I believe in free speech, especially on anonymous forums and boards, it doesn’t have to be contrary to just being a decent human being. Being free to be a shitty person and being shitty to make a point shouldn’t be mutually exclusive is all I’m saying.

  • Exactly so baning smug would be censorship.

  • Why not just link your steam account what are you hiding?

  • that’s highly Hypocritical.

  • But handheld gaming is long dead.

  • dathip


  • Riosine

    So you want irrefutable “proof” about the quality of art? That strongly implies a mathematical generalization of art. And, unfortunately for your claims, there is:

    symmetries,perspectives (a linear projection of a plane), Tendencies to trascental numbers (pi and phi, ie curves and proportions) and many others can be identified in art works. And not just that, the brain actively scan for those mathematical pattern to tell if something looks good / sexy, or in negation, ugly.

    Natural tendency to Fibonacci series (whose limit is the golden ratio):

    Since those variable been available in nature for a long time, our subcouncios mind evolved a way to assign them a “subjective” good / bad value.

    Thus Quality of an art piece can be measured by how closely the artist’s painting match mathematical patterns and how they can be used to either maximize good or bad looking.

    Hope that help.

    There is also a mathematical approach for Music
    throught natural.Logarithm

  • Kiryu

    Please don’t become Gematsu 2.

  • “symmetries,perspectives (a linear projection of a plane), Tendencies to trascental numbers (pi and phi, ie curves and proportions) and many others can be identified in art works.”

    And none of that is objectively good or bad. Asymmetry, wonky perspectives, and edges can be intentionally used.

    There’s no “good” or “bad” circle, there’s an incorrect or correct circle, to which we attribute “good” or “bad” if we want, but math does not concern itself with that.

    “Thus Quality of an art piece can be measured by how closely the artist’s painting match mathematical patterns and how they can be used to maximize good or bad looking.”

    Architecture clearly trumps any other art form because some retard thinks geometry is “beauty”. As if beauty is the only thing people praise in art too…

    Try again.

  • Anon_Amous

    Yeah, I need to see how this game expands before I judge it that hard. Still from what I’ve played so far my previous statement stands.

  • No_Good_Names_Ever

    Maybe but with Squares habit of having high ass expectations, I always figure they’re just that full of themselves.

  • YES! Please don’t!

  • Alistair

    I’m not gonna split hairs with the likes of you.

    Not a single spelling mistake.

    I say this one last time, square Enix did say if FF15 doesn’t sold well it will be the end of them.

    Understand now.

  • Travis Touchdown

    >X has a much smaller map

    No it doesn’t…

  • Riosine

    “And none of that is objectively good or bad.”
    They are as metric scale, you can measure how accurate an precise those are depicted, most of the time in millimeters … Are you aware that if you put a painting into electron microscope it will look horribly pixelated and even gappy

    “Asymmetry, wonky perspectives, and edges can be intentionally used.”
    I already mentioned that when I subtly said “in negation” at the last of that paragraph.
    Sure those can be used to create a creepy along with aposemantic coloration.

    “geometry is “beauty” As if beauty is the only thing people praise in art too”

    Thats False since I clearly said, before, that an artist can maximize beauty, ugly or even Both.
    and not only that without geometry you could not even draw anything in first place, 3D models/meshes are a simple proof of that.

    Lastly if SI natural metrics and mathematics aren’t objective enought for you, and they are enought for scientist to describe nature, then you are clearly in a state of Negation.

  • Kengofu

    Dude that doesn’t even make sense. They released a turn-based Final Fantasy title weeks earlier and it has the ATB system. There’s Bravely Default/Second which are solid turn-based games on a platform that most people who play video games have. I Am Setsuna is also turn-based. Why should their mainline series occupy a space that 3 or more other products already occupy within their company? What about those games is such a problem for people to play? Is it because Square didn’t want to pour the larger aspects of their budget into something that wasn’t an action RPG? Is it the visuals of the previous game not looking as good as XV? I legitimately would like to know why XV and the other products have which are basically just Final Fantasy in different flavors can’t exist in the same space for people.

  • This doesn’t answer what I said.

    “Lastly if SI natural metrics and mathematics aren’t objective enought for you”

    Natural metrics and mathematics are not definers of objective artistic quality.

  • Uncle Slick

    I was correcting you for not using a comma.

    And no, it’s not censorship if you ban an asshole.

    I got banned from /r/the_donald and they’re all about anti censorship.

  • Riosine

    “Natural metrics and mathematics are not definers of objective artistic quality”

    Which is inherently absurd since mathematics englobes pretty much this whole universe and whatever could exist but didn’t.

    Mathematical frameworks can be formulated to analyse and evaluate practically any system, even infinites.

    And painters often try to mimic naturally occurring stuff.Sometimes even abstract natural phenomenae such as space-time dilation and Non-Euclidean geometry, like the Dali clock does

    So this either implies you are greatly understimating Mathematics or simply in denial.

  • Are you mentally retarded?

    Why is it so hard to understand that mathematics do not prove something to be “good” or “bad” which is what “quality” and “lack of quality” respectively are?

    I guess English is one hard language for you.

  • Sorry dude but banning someone because you don’t like or agree with them is censorship. That sort of shit isn’t done here. If you would like a safe space gemastu is always a option.

  • Riosine

    Again you are understimating mathematics.

    Mathematics can be used to tell wheter something is good or bad, better or worse, throught a simple Metrics system set in the Real number to quantify observed mathematical patterns and qualities.

    “”good” or “bad” which is what “quality” and “lack of quality” respectively are?”
    No. good and bad can be represented as a positive and negative quantity, respectively, in the Real number set.

    While Quality and lack of quality can be represented as the module operation of an array of multiple dimensional measures, with the resulting score being in the natural number set (from 0 to infinite)

    (A dimension is a different quality being measured)

    Finally you can compare what is better by simply computing the greater score.

    And that is the very basic of dimensional Analysis. Art isn’t exempt of this practise, nor anything else.

  • Uncle Slick

    Oh fuck off with the safe spaces. People get banned for acting like a schmuck all the time.

    Don’t want to get banned? Don’t act like a schmuck.

    If it was your website, you’d ban everyone that pissed you off and don’t deny it.

    It’s not censorship if you break rules and get banned, it means you fucked up.

  • Sorry child but the world doesn’t work that way. Who decides what being a schmuck entails? Time to live in the adult world. If someone says something you don’t like either ignore them or debate then do go full SJW and try to silence them.

    If I had my own forum I would not ban people that piss me off because I am not a stupid child. I hate censorship in all form and I fully support freedom of speech. If you like mods that ban opposing views than gematsu is a great place for you.

  • No, mathematics have nothing to do with quality since mathematics do not make any such judgements.

    As I said, you have some screws loose.

  • Choppinfoot

    Your first post has atrocious grammar, to the point where it’s almost unintelligible; now I understand what you’re trying to say.

  • Riosine

    I simply told you those “judgements” or observations can be properly quantitized and analysed with mathematics tool. Ergo a metric to review the quality can be formulated.

    Is such a thing so hard to grasp?

  • Since mathematics can’t make quality judgements, that means that whatever you’re measuring with it is not quality.

    Is such a thing hard to grasp?

  • Riosine

    Of course its, Since you are now implying that quality can’t be observed ergo doesn’t exist.

    whereas I only need to demonstrate that A > B in at least 1 property to prove that A is of better quality than B in such category. That work for anything

    So why is art so special and non trivial that its, Somehow, immune to such process?

  • Uncle Slick

    You mean like you’re doing right now?

    Fucking cuck.

    Also, the world can work any way you want it to, as long as you have the power.

    Once you grow up past your teens I’m sure you’ll understand.

  • Simple answer: Because art is subjective, you fucking moron.

    Longer answer: There is no way for you to objectively claim that A > B in art, no matter what categories you try to compare. Mona Lisa isn’t better than The Starry Night or vice-versa.

    That’s because art, unlike a knife, for example, has no practical use or anything similar to that, that can be measured in the form of:

    Y is good (is of quality) as characteristic of X

    X is Y
    thus X is good (is of quality)

    In which Y is sharpness and X is a knife. Disregard grammar, that’s not the point. Clearly, a sharp knife is of quality (disregard durability or anything of the sorts, take a single characteristic for now, I’m giving you that leeway) since the objective of a knife is to cut.

    Y in art is ‘beauty’ or ’emotional power’, that’s the purpose of art, both are completely personal though AKA subjective, with each person that looks at an art form, Y not only becomes something else, the common characteristics that the onlookers might think of when seeing the same art pieces could also be ‘bad’, ‘average’ or ‘good’ or in-between these three.

  • Smug

    at this point, I’m curious how good you are at drawing/painting

  • Riosine

    I see your logic now, you do not care that much about the art piece itself, but rather the effect it generates in the viewer and call it a “emotional power”. (You also claim its an useless property at least in a practical way)

    Well, you let me no other choice than moving the goal post, and propose a secondary, transitive, quality standard, this time in function of the viewer via brain scanning to determine that thing that you want, the emotional potential, and hence be subject to analysis and ranking.

    Because today subjectivity can also be measured throught Neuroimaging, and there is a strong genetic connection with respect to likings

  • That’s what art has to do by definition, there was never anything else.

    Also, you are now claiming that art pieces that do not provide a positive feeling are now not of quality. I guess you’re now claiming art like Guernica is bad.

    Your paper is also not relevant to this argument. Mainly because we’re discussing an objective way to define quality in art, objective meaning an universal criteria, not popularity, you’re outright being fallacious again. And there is a practical factor in food and taste, unlike art, to which I also have to add that taste in art does not necessarily function in the same way like “taste” or “taste in food” because they use the same word.

    “Emotional power” includes all types of “emotions”. And taste while eating, as said even in your paper is all about the “positive”, which e.g. negative emotions do not necessarily provide.

  • I’m pretty fucking shit actually. I can’t even get over the reluctance of getting used to using a pen tablet with no screen. But since I learned to play Dwarf Fortress, I might have a new perspective now. I just don’t get how people can draw curves in the direction they want on these things…

    Discussing about quality in art is irrelevant to my, yours or Mr. Rockefeller ‘s ability to produce art though.

    Or I guess you’re not permitted to discuss how deadly cancer is because you’ve never extirpated one before?

  • Riosine

    “art that not provide a positive feeling are now not of quality”

    I never claimed such a thing.However I actually implied that if an art piece does not produce any feeling response at all, then its bad

    “paper is also not relevant to this argument”
    I used the Paper to simply prove the DNA relationship with likings and feelings. although yeah It would be more relevant if the topic was art (cuisine).

    “You are being phallacious”
    Look I can commit as many “informal” fallacies I want, but only as long as I can demonstrate them to work, through a proof
    So this time was Ad populum, I think, However I have already demonstrated are not the viewers themselves but their genes.

    Thus a model that predicts how emotion inducing an art piece can be, for every linear combination of genes for any given species, can be formulated after thoroughly understanding how genes regulate the feelings of the viewers

  • Kek.
    Do you even know the meaning of that word child? Because you are using it incorrectly. Take your pro censorship bullshit to gematsu as we don’t like your kind here.
    I guess you will want me to get banned too now. XD

  • ‘I never claimed such a thing.However I actually implied that if an art
    piece does not produce any feeling response at all, then its bad’

    Inducing a state of apathy is still an emotional response and I’d actually claim it’s impossible not only to induce a state of apathy but also to have someone not react in any way to something (extreme cases aside which will never reach a majority), I mean, you’ve proven it with your paper.

    ‘I used the Paper to simply prove the DNA relationship with likings and feelings. ‘

    Irrelevant still.

    ‘as long as I can demonstrate them to work, through a proof’

    That’s the issue, you didn’t demonstrate them to work. Yes indeed, if I talked about how popular something is, I would have agreed with you.

    But I’m talking about quality here.

    Which is why I said it’s irrelevant still, besides other factors…

    ‘However I have already demonstrated these are not the viewers themselves but their genes.’

    The viewers are their genes, but knock yourself out, it doesn’t matter.

    ‘Thus a model that predicts how emotion inducing an art piece can be’

    Since the crux of your argument relies on something impossible, your whole argument died out.

    Besides the fact that the definition never talked about how strong the emotional response has to be, just that it has to exist at all, which is technically impossible not to.

    See, your paper is right in one regard, there will always be an emotional response. I’ll thank you for that one…

  • Riosine

    “Inducing a state of apathy is still an emotional response and I’d
    actually claim it’s impossible not only to induce a state of apathy”

    Wrong procedure You are forgetting about the control. If there is no change whatsoever from the test subject and the control, that can be an identical twin or the same person before viewing, then the art piece failed to generate an emotion

    “The viewers are their genes, but knock yourself out, it doesn’t matter.”
    Not necessary
    Since the crux of your argument relies on something impossible, your whole argument died out”

    Funny because its actually doable for Phallometry, measuring how arousing porn can be via measuring phallus erection rate.

    My argument is just a generalization of that for every art form.
    Now of course it would be quite an enormeous project. but since genes and their combinations are not infinites, then the project itself is not impossible either.

    So once enought research in genetics is done, genes can be factored out of the equation and the effectiveness of the painting itself can isolated by linear algebra.

    “Besides the fact that the definition never talked about how strong the emotional response has to be, just that it has to exist”

    well that is because its and old definition, today we know we can measure those reactions and that, back then it was though feeling and consciousness were little more than magic sparks of divinity

  • Guin

    Your argument would actually hold water if you didn’t resort to the same labeling and condescension you criticize them for.

  • Kengofu

    What even are you talking about?

  • Guin

    Reread your posts and ask yourself if you aren’t guilty of acting like a holier than thou deity looking down on those you disagree with scorn and dismissal. Pot calling kettle black and all that.

  • Uncle Slick

    Take your pro censorship bullshit to gematsu as we don’t like your kind here.”

    WOAH! Wouldn’t that be censoring me? You could just ignore me if you don’t like what I’m saying! :D

    Keep self reflecting on me, shit stain. Maybe you’ll turn into less of a cuck.

  • Not really as I am not forcing you to go to gematsu. Now banning Smug would be censoring as you want to force him to leave. You are so stupid you don’t even know what censoring is? Now I understand why you always say moronic things. XD

  • Kengofu

    Uh no, I look down on people who make it their business to be as directly shitty to people in this community as possible. Not the same as actively engaging them with the express intent of personally demeaning them. Nothing I’ve said is hypocritical. In fact, my original statement was about how entertaining the comment section is. It is. I see no issue with this.

  • Guin

    Nah, you’re just justifying your amusement of being part of the shitshow by acting as a detached bystander and offering your “input” as some form of ego stroking. Anyone who uses their gray matter could easily point that out.

  • Kengofu

    Well, I’m going to further say that the comments are still goddamn hilarious. You already have your opinion about me hardwired in, I disagree with that, so at this point, we can agree to disagree.

  • Uncle Slick

    This seems to be the threshold of your intelligence.

    Seeing as how you go “XD”, and don’t even understand basic sentence patterns, I assume you’re a 13 year old girl that plays Maple Story.

    Keep on whining about banning = censorship. Maybe someone will care.

  • So you are not going respond to any of my points? You children always disappoint me with your lack of logic. Try to get people that hurt your feelings banned else where kid as that shit don’t fly here.

  • Uncle Slick

    Cognitive dissonance.

  • I guess not.

  • Karo

    You disgust me,

  • Minuteworld92
  • Minuteworld92


  • Minuteworld92

    Fuck off reddit