Why Gaming is Not and Will Never Be a Real “Addiction”

This is an editorial piece. The views and opinions expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views and opinions of, and should not be attributed to, Niche Gamer as an organization.

Ah, the time honored tradition of demonizing a popular form of entertainment that is in danger of supplanting your own as the hobby of choice for a new generation.

With tabletop RPGs, Pokemon, and comic books all having passed that awkward phase of their growth to mainstream acceptance and approval, it seems that gaming’s gangly and acne-infested teen years aren’t quite over with yet, plus it still hasn’t learned what that tightness in its pants really is.

All jokes aside, it’s getting a bit old by now, isn’t it? If we aren’t insulting the people who play the games, it seems we’re attacking the ones who make them instead. It’s just one gigantic merry-go-round of fit-pitching that shows no sign of ceasing and accomplishes absolutely nothing other than to give geeks something to bitch about in online comment wars.

So what’s the big deal this time? What makes this attack so worthy of critique that I’d dust off my angry editorial writing cap and put it on for another coronary-inducing, rage-filled rant against it? Well, apparently some well-respected scientists have decided that gaming is now a medical addiction and should be included in their official list of diagnoses.

I know, it’s a gold mine for jokes concerning cripple-bux and SSI, but let’s try to stay serious about this.

My first thought when I first read this was something Dave Chapelle’s character said in his movie “Half Baked”. In it, he tried going to a drug abuse support group to kick his Marijuana addiction. Once he went on stage and admitted his “Addiction”, the crowd – which was made up of other addicts – became angry at him. One, played by the famous Bob Saget, made the declaration that it wasn’t a real addiction and asked that, quote, “Have you ever sucked dick for some marijuana?”

Yes, I’m well aware of the fact that drug addiction is no laughing matter, but anyone with any common sense knows the kernel of truth in this scene. Not all drugs or addictions to those drugs are the same. Someone getting treated for doing cocaine will be handled differently than someone being treated for, say, nicotine. This isn’t due to one being legal and the other not, but instead due to one being especially lethal and not only easy to overdose on, but has permanent and devastating effects on the human body.

For a more in depth explanation, talk to any recovering addict. I’ve worked with a few and from what they’ve told me in confidence and in private is enough to scare anyone straight. They’ve been arrested, jumped people for cash to buy drugs, sold their bodies, and stolen from friends just to get high. Then, even after getting their fix, they have to deal with lost teeth, large sores opening up on their body, destruction of the soft tissue in the sinuses, organ failure, and heart disease.

Doing pot for ten years won’t open holes in your nose or cause you to lose your teeth due to gum deterioration, but doing meth or crack sure will.

The point here is that not all addictions are worthy of being “treated”. Nobody is rushing off to the nearest substance abuse center to treat their addiction to coffee, sugary snacks, or nictotine. Yes, there are over-the-counter products you can buy that claim to curb the desire for those things, but for all intents and purposes, we can safely classify these as substances that do no real harm beyond maybe giving you diabetes or lung cancer.

“Oh wow Carl, lung cancer and diabetes aren’t big deals, huh?” Good point, and one of the frequent rebuttals I hope to address here.

Look at it this way, everyone needs something to fill the hole in their spirit. I don’t care how self-actualized you are, you are inevitably going to need something to make the pain of adult life go away. Every single adult on this planet has at least one guilty pleasure that dulls that pain and makes the agony of their over-thinking mind melt away. Laugh at my phrasing of it, but when you find yourself alone with your own thoughts and begin dwelling on past mistakes or future anxieties, you’ll need something to help alleviate that anguish you feel. Sure, a psychiatrist can help, but people are frail and society forces us into situations we can’t always find a way out of.

And that’s where your addiction will fit in.

For some it’s sex. For some it’s porn. Still others may opt for “easier to get away with” addictions like food or smoking. Either way, you’ll need something to fill that hole that leaves you incomplete, and the trick is finding a balance between legality and bodily damage. Like a former crack addict co-worker who I once talked to (who was 19 months sober at the time he told me), he traded hard drug use for lottery scratch-off tickets and cigarettes. He even complained to me that he wanted to quit them too. You know what I told him?

“You need something that makes you happy, and there’s nothing wrong with either of those things.”

My point? You need to pick and choose your battles, and like Bob Saget’s character said in the video I linked above, comparing a benign and mostly harmless addiction to something like crack or meth is not only ridiculous, but actually belittles the price real addicts have to pay when addicted to “real” addictions.

“But Carl” you say with an arrogant sneer, “Gaming is a sedentary past time, and increases one’s chance for heart disease, obesity, and a variety of other such horrible illnesses!”

First of all, so do a lot of hobbies. You can binge watch TV all day and that’s accepted, but yet you’d be suffering the same maladies in the same time span of use. Drinking unfiltered, nitrate-heavy tap water can have much the same effects, as can eating white bread, eating red meat, and drinking soda. Or, as my father always told me when I’d tell him to quit tobacco and live a clean life like mine: “The air I breathe is giving me cancer, so what’s the difference if my illness happens 10-20 years sooner than yours?”

I know it’s an exaggeration, but what he said is still true. It’s all about common sense and degrees of lethality and legality. If something is legal and does nothing to harm the people around you or completely debilitate you, then what’s the point in making a big stink about it and classifying it as some harmful addiction in need of treatment?

“But Carl” you scream with indignant rage, “there are people who live in their mother’s basement, don’t get a job, and do nothing but game dozens of hours a week and are a drain on our nation’s economy!”

This is true, but I have two problems with this rebuttal that I often receive and I’m going to go through each in detail.

First of all, this stereotype is not as common as gaming’s detractors would have you believe. Are there such people? I do know of one who is on my Steam friend’s list, but his problem is depression and as a young man, he is unable to find a job because he has no education, and he has no education because he doesn’t have enough money, and he can’t afford school because he has poor credit and no job. Even a conservative capitalist like me feels sorry for the kid. However, his problem isn’t gaming, his problem is a world that has left his generation behind and he has very few ways out of it that his problems with anxiety and social awkwardness will allow him to take.

That being said, the stereotype of the “basement dwelling manbaby playing games at mommy’s house” is vastly overblown, and even in cases where such a person exists, there is a deeper problem that is the cause of it that needs addressing, such as anxiety or depression. Gaming isn’t the cause, gaming is only a symptom. The real addiction is to self-pity. I spent most of 2007 laid off of work and never leaving my house, content to collect unemployment checks and marathoning all the Might & Magic games until the debt collectors started calling and I was threatened with eviction. Some don’t have the fortitude to fight through that.

Secondly, what’s wrong with playing video games 20, 30, or more than 40 hours a week? If you’re paying your bills, working a full time job, and take care of yourself…what’s wrong with spending every waking second of your free time gaming? In my 20s when I cared less about joining real-life social networks and was content getting all of my social interaction from the Blizzard forums, I would work from 7am to 4pm, then by 5pm be on my PC playing RPGs until 2am, only to get a few hours sleep and wake up at 6am to do it all over again. I was playing games as much as I was working, and only left the house to buy new games or make money to buy those games. By the definition gaming’s hipster detractors enjoy repeating on social media and their fancy blogs, I would be that basement-dwelling manbaby whittling away his free time playing the vidya.

Yet I had a car I paid off, a house I lived in and paid taxes on, and was never (at least until my unemployment ran out) late with a bill. Even after I found a new job in 2008, I still gamed anywhere from 25-30 hours a week and did very little else except power through whatever new RPG came out that month. Well, that and get into arguments about character builds on forums.

My point is that as long as your adult obligations are met, there’s nothing wrong with partaking in a mostly harmless hobby, such as TV binging, gaming, or bitching on social media, that does comparatively little damage to you or others around you.

“But Carl” you shake your fist in defiance, “Gaming can lead to violence and can cause some impressionable or at-risk people to act out in dangerous or illegal ways!”

This has been covered before, and for every “Harris & Klebold were addicted to DOOM” case that is trotted out, you could pick just as many, if not more, cases of kids doing the same thing that didn’t even play video games. These include cases such as Virginia Tech shooter Seung-Hui Cho who they frantically tried to link to gaming, but found out his psychosis was caused by repeated listening of the song “Shine” by the Christian alt-rock band Collective Soul.

They even tried to pin gaming on Adam Lanza’s actions, but the best they could do is discover he was a frequent poster on 4chan, like every other autistic 20-something with no real job prospects. Which sort of brings me back to my earlier point that hopelessness and depression is the real culprit and frequent reliance on fantasy worlds (such as those found in games) is merely a symptom of a larger problem unrelated to any “addiction”.

For many, including myself, gaming fills a hole that would probably otherwise be stuffed with illegal drugs and/or hazardous and self-destructive behaviors. It acts as a way to unwind and shut off our minds so that we aren’t so fixated on our problems as we are when times are quiet and boredom leaves us alone with our own thoughts. It’s a way to power-down and relax in such a way that also gives us the added benefit of feeling proud about something. We can look at our scores or accomplishments in the game and feel like we’ve done something worthy of note, and the small measure of joy a gamer gets from conquering a game or earning a hard-fought achievement is as safe and effective a “high” as one can hope to get in the modern world.

It makes me think about my time spent working in my first job, a small east coast department store chain that I was employed at from 1994 to 2006.

One thing you’ll notice if you’re a quiet person at work is that people will start prodding you with questions about your personal life in what normal folks call “getting to know you”. While I find it incredibly exhausting, it’s something you have to learn to deal with if you ever intend to portray yourself as a normal, functioning person in modern society. Out of all the questions they’ll ask you, the most annoying is “What do you do for fun?”

In every job I’ve ever had, every co-worker eventually asked this question of me. During my teens and 20s, I made the horrible mistake of telling the truth. I answered, quite plainly, that I play video games. Don’t do that.

From that point on, I was labeled “that geeky guy” and was frequently (but playfully) ribbed as such. A few female co-workers would imitate controller or keyboard movements with their hands and laugh about it when others would describe their plans for the weekend and then point to me and ask me what mine were. Yes yes…my plans were always to stay inside and tear through another CRPG…but every single one of my co-workers, even those I was on very good terms with, decided that was worthy of ridicule.

When I moved away from that city and found a new job, I knew what my answer to that question would be. “What do you do when you’re not working, Carl?” I’ll respond: “Oh, I binge watch Amazon Prime and Netflix shows”

Never once, not a single time in fact, did any derision or ridicule result from such an admittance. Matter of fact, I actually made close friends at work after saying that and we’d compare our watchlists. Of course, I didn’t really watch that much TV, but I knew enough in passing to fake my way through long conversations. There was even one fellow I worked with who I befriended that would always give me these long lists of shows to check out, but I honestly never watched them. I was far too busy playing RPGs to really give a shit about something as boring and passive as watching a TV show.

Of course, I know what people would say to me. “You just need to ask around and see who is a gamer in your job!”

Sorry, but fitting in at work, which is what I need in order to continue eating, is far more important to me than being honest. It also drills home the perception gaming has to the outside world and how it’s viewed by people in my generation (40+) and older. Granted, the job I’m at now has a lot of young people and these 20-year old kids are floored when they find out a grey haired 42 year old man like me has been gaming hardcore for 36 years, but it’s more of the exception to the rule than it is the reality.

So what have I spent the last 2,000 words trying to say? That perhaps when we call something an addiction, we should first make sure it has a significant chance of lethality to the user and those around them and is epidemical in severity. Or, at least in cases such as nicotine or alcohol, it is a socially accepted form of substance abuse that can rapidly kill in some cases and has been known to affect others nearby (whether through secondhand smoke or a drunk driver).

If my tinfoil hat wasn’t still in the wash, I’d go on a long rant about how this is similar to what South Korea’s radfem government has done, but lucky for you (and my carpal tunnel), it’s too damp to wear.

Instead, let’s just all head down to our nearest substance abuse clinic and tell the guys helping crackheads and heroin users kick their habit that we play NieR: Automata too much and that we need help before we get permanent orange fingertips from the Cheetos dust we’re exposed to every night.

Let me know how long they laugh at you before kicking you out or calling the cops.

Editor’s Note: Main thumbnail via Getty Images; NieR: Automata artwork via 



Carl is both a JRPG fan and a CRPG'er who especially loves European PC games. Even with more than three decades of gaming under his belt, he feels the best of the hobby is yet to come.

  1. Anonymoose
    January 4, 2018 at 2:15 pm

    They couldn’t figure out a way to tax it the same way you can advertise and tax television, sports broadcasting in particular. Especially after the whole market appeared to resoundingly denounce the whole loot box gambling thing. They are now resorting to the nuclear option of: “shut it down”.

  2. Mr0303
    January 4, 2018 at 2:16 pm

    Gaming like many other things has the potential to be an addiction. While not as severe as alcohol or drugs the endorphins released when playing games could lead people susceptible to addiction to an unhealthy lifestyle. In my view the amount you play is not an issue as long as you keep a healthy balance and not put gaming in front of your personal health.

  3. Riosine
    January 4, 2018 at 2:18 pm

    Today addictions are understood as a epigentics dna mutations due to adaptation to the use of psychotropic substances

    Now Such kind of epigenitics adaptations haven’t been observed for playing game yet. Hence they nature is still unknow, they might be a normal or addictive mutation, vary in a person basis etc. and Most of the knowledge of gaming being addictive is being simply extrapolated from ludopathy / Gambling addiction

  4. cowboyjimmy
    January 4, 2018 at 2:35 pm

    well said, unless you’re reached a point in your life where you need to suck a dick for it, you’re not an addict.

  5. GamesGoodMeGood
    January 4, 2018 at 2:39 pm

    What a start to 2018. It’s going to get even worse.

    Just when you thought that gamers have enough on their plates with SJWs, feminists and the mainstream games media. Now along come the professional organizations and possibly the government.

  6. Snorlaxation
    January 4, 2018 at 2:54 pm

    reminds of that guy from youtube who got backlash for having sex to get a switch (and plane tickets, i think)

  7. Mechonis
    January 4, 2018 at 3:00 pm

    I find people at work who play games and they’re casuals. That said, I don’t care for derogatory terms towards me over games. Anyone whose played online has experienced shittalk far worse then you’ll ever hear irl.

    Yeah I play games. I play L4D2 competitively, I play 100% Orange Juice, and I play Falcom games. All on PC. That goes over their head. I can sort get along well enough talking about Nintendo games but I don’t want to bother with Destiny, with CoD, or Overwatch. I also play an average of 40+ hours a week. My weekend is always games. And I have a good job I do well at and plan to move up in. I’m not a perfect adult, but I’m not getting drunk daily and wasting away at strip bars which is the norm. Sure I spend a lot on games, but hey, I’m going to build my own computer because of it. That’s a valuable skill to have.

    Tl;dr- Fuck normies

  8. TiroDvD
    January 4, 2018 at 3:02 pm

    See ExtraCreditz on Youtube for more authentic discussions on gaming addition. E.g. they clearly explain the psychological definition of Addiction and show that playing video games isn’t that. However people keep playing games excessively and unhealthy, which would make it a -Compulsion-.

  9. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 4, 2018 at 3:24 pm

    Take away people’s incentive to start a family while making the bachelor life hard enough as it is, and how do we solve the problem? By demonizing the one affordable and endlessly entertaining hobby thats really the safest way people can self medicate, of course!

    Great article btw.

  10. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 4, 2018 at 3:25 pm

    2018 is going to be the Empire Strikes Back of 2017

  11. A Punk Named Katsuya Jonouchi
    A Punk Named Katsuya Jonouchi
    January 4, 2018 at 4:09 pm

    Seems like the media is always trying to demonize gaming in some way or another, It’s socially acceptable to spend your entire day off binge watching Netflix. but clocking in a few hours of quality gaming is a cardinal sin? At the end of the day anything can become an addiction if you let it get out of control. I say just let people do what they want in there spare time and let bygones be bygones. I don’t give a damn whether you like watching TV, listening to music, reading, gardening, traveling, cooking, gaming, etc. If it’s what brings you joy and it doesn’t lead to an unhealthy lifestyle then by all means keep on enjoying it.

  12. Muten
    January 4, 2018 at 4:45 pm

    I read too many articles about videogames, am i addicted to gaming articles?

    I usually have 8 hours of leasure a day, am i addicted to free time? thats like 1/3 of ones life man :O

  13. Arenegeth
    January 4, 2018 at 4:45 pm

    I think anything can become an addiction for people with addictive personalities.

    I also think, there’s a thin line to what people perceive as an ‘addiction’, ‘obsessive behavior’ and being driven.

    In practice, the divide between those three is the value we place on the target of an individual, and the result of their obsession, starting from self-destructive and ending with successful or lucrative.

    So yeah, games can be additive. I’ve been around an MMORPG long enough to know of its addictive qualities first hand, even if I never felt I was in a position were I couldn’t stop, I did end up doing 15+ hour sessions a few times and that is something I very rarely done with single player games. And on occasion my longer than usual playtime had an effect, though minimal in my case, in my real life responsibilities. And of course I’ve observed other players behavior during my time there to know that it can get far worse, bordering on self destructive.

    Mobile game whales, would be another facet of that, what sort of healthy individual would play up to thousands of dollars on basically valueless digital trinkets other than someone with an addiction or at least an obsession?

    I think Carl is focusing too much on the concept of ‘physical additions’ as if mental ones can’t be as self destructive (like a gambling addiction) and also a lot more harder to be weened out of, since you can’t simply go cold turkey, to get them out of your system and move on with your life.

    Now that doesn’t mean that I agree that gaming is a mental illness onto itself, I think that is a useless distinction, since people that would get addicted, genuinely, self-destructively addicted to gaming, would probably be addicted to something else if gaming wasn’t around.

    But let’s not fool ourselves, in thinking that some of those MMO players, wouldn’t suck a dick or two, to get their MMO fix, if for some reason the object of their obsession was scarce, or prohibitively expensive.

    I also see no need, this day and age, to defend the medium, a multi-billion dollar industry that has outperformed the movie industry no less, from naysayers and detractors, trying to paint it in a bad light (and I’m also not convinced that’s what these scientists were trying to do necessarily).

    I was never insecure of having this hobby and always upset that a lot my fellow gamers were, and always being so defensive about it. I like games, I will always play games, if you have a problem with that you can go fuck yourself, I don’t need anyone’s approval on how I chose to spend my time and definitely not their permission, if every other gamer had this attitude we’d have a lot more mature conversations amongst us I think.

    So in closing, games can be self-destructively addictive, and so can fucking anything, since some people are just wired this way, and anyone can be obsessive about something as long as they get positive reinforcement and self fulfillment out of it, it only becomes an addiction, when it becomes self-destructive and when you can’t stop doing it.

  14. VersVlees
    January 4, 2018 at 4:48 pm

    Well with the way all the AAA”s are going with them loot box mechanics. I can see some poor schmuck sucking some dick in a dark alley to buy some crystals, shark cards, engrams, ultimate team packs or whatever they call it.

  15. RetroGamer
    January 4, 2018 at 5:18 pm

    On occasion, I’ll get tired of gaming and go a few weeks or months without playing any. I do not recall ever experiencing any symptoms of withdrawal.

  16. Audie Bakerson
    Audie Bakerson
    January 4, 2018 at 5:28 pm

    Addiction requires withdrawl.

  17. Shiggy Diggy Doo
    Shiggy Diggy Doo
    January 4, 2018 at 5:33 pm

    >Extra Credits
    >Authentic discussion
    >Extra “Bandwidth is a limited resource” Credits

    Holy fuck dude

  18. chaoguy
    January 4, 2018 at 5:38 pm

    There’s one key piece of info Carl: The claim it’s an addiction is scientifically hokum.
    Dr. Chris Ferguson and several other psychologists claim that some of the WHO’s research compared apparent victims compulsive behaviors to substance abusers.
    “There are many myths such as that games involve dopamine and brain regions similar to substance abuse,” […] “There’s a kernel of truth to that but only insofar as any pleasurable activity activates these regions. How gaming involves them is more similar to other fun activities like eating chocolate, having sex, getting a good grade, etc., not heroin or cocaine.”
    University of Oxford psychologist Andrew Przybylski added that “It’s a very bad idea.”- concerned that most studies done on gaming addiction are of low quality and making gaming addiction as a true disorder could risk “stigmatizing millions of players and may divert limited mental health resources from core psychiatric problems such as depression or anxiety which might be at the heart of problematic play,”

    Want to know where this comes from? Fucking Kotaku:
    One of the literal worse gaming journalism outlets have been given/found evidece that proves the push for Gaming Addiction is based off bad data.

    That, combined with it draining resources to deal with depression, trauma, anxiety, and societal issues making people “delve” into videogames, further stigmatization of a hobby that can’t have it to keep it’s artistic expression, and to prevent god knows who from profiting off this by stripping away a release from people- all on a lie;
    There is no reason no serious, free, and people-respecting government should even consider the judgement of the WHO based off their current reports.

    Now you need to do your part. Make your voice clear to the WHO and your local government- you object to this bill, and will resist it by all means. You will not vote for people who support it. You will inform others of it being bullshit. And you will defend yourself if someone tries to drag you off to some rubber room on false pretenses.

  19. chaoguy
    January 4, 2018 at 5:40 pm

    Horrific source aside, compulsion is addiction by another name. And some people are addicted to activities that should not prove addictive to a healthy mind. As Carl says- it’s to help cope with other issues.

  20. chaoguy
    January 4, 2018 at 5:44 pm

    And to prove their point- the WHO could (hypothetically) take a depressed guy, throw him in a rubber room with no entertainment (or some dull books/films), and wait for his boredom and depression to manifest in an angry or violent manner as they poke him with a stick.
    “See- this is withdrawl! Gaming addiction is real” Says the World Health Organization doctor as his patient is curled up in a ball crying due to his actions.

    There’s a hundred ways they could take people with other issues, slap the controller from their hand, and frame it to prove their point.

  21. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 4, 2018 at 5:44 pm

    Gaming might not be an addiction in the same way that hard drugs are but you might want to reconsider how much of an impact it has on your life, if you’re willing to type up an article that’s over 2,700 words and opening with the suggestion that gaming, as a whole, tabletop gaming is more accepted by the mainstream than video games…

    Maybe it’s regional, or because I grew up in a generation where almost every middle class household had a NES and if they didn’t it was a because they had a Master System, but gaming was always something that was a hell of a lot more mainstream than tabletop gaming. Hell, I had a friend who went to freaking anime conventions wonder why the hell I would do something as Dungeons & Dragons… Back when anime was either carefully curated for Western tastes or fan-subbed VHS of questionable quality.

    The personal anecdote about getting mocked when you’re a teenager and in your early 20’s is also a bit out of place… Because you were dealing with people who were still in high school or still thought that the high school hierarchies were important and chances are they’d have thought you were just as much of a freak if you dressed all in black and listed to the Bauhaus. (Basically, if you were part of any counterculture.)

    But hey, I never gave a shit what people thought of my hobbies, since I was used to the odd looks and being a dude who was into punk rock and heavy metal and looked the part… Well, I suppose part of me enjoyed playing the role of outcast. But all the controversy around this… it just seems like a lot of complaints about nothing and I was genuinely surprised it wasn’t considered an addiction already when porn and gambling are… *Shrugs.*

  22. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 4, 2018 at 5:48 pm

    I think anyone who still buys EA game sucks dick

  23. Feniks
    January 4, 2018 at 6:23 pm

    Depends, technically gambling is a game right?

    You’ll be amazed how touchy people get over their precious Granblue.

  24. SLoWMoTIoN
    January 4, 2018 at 6:48 pm

    If gaming addiction is real than so is watching tv all day.

  25. random
    January 4, 2018 at 7:35 pm

    I don’t think using memes is an effective way of laying out an argument.

    Also classifying certain forms of game playing is not about demonisation, it’s about getting people help instead of dismissing it.
    A big part of game development is dedicated to keeping players around, or making sure that they play only your game, psychology plays a big part in how games are effective at doing this, which of course is going to lead to some people getting addicted. No one is saying that everyone who plays games is addicted.

  26. Galvanized Dreamer
    Galvanized Dreamer
    January 4, 2018 at 8:21 pm

    It’s just a replacement for Metal music. They need a sacrifical goat, and games are a convenient choice.

  27. Galvanized Dreamer
    Galvanized Dreamer
    January 4, 2018 at 8:24 pm

    Tell me that it is addiction when somebody dies of starvation in front of a computer while playing video games. (outside South Korea, the place that has Fan Death; or Japan, with close to the highest suicide rates in the world.)

  28. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 4, 2018 at 8:52 pm

    How is being a “bachelor” hard in anyway?

  29. A Punk Named Katsuya Jonouchi
    A Punk Named Katsuya Jonouchi
    January 4, 2018 at 9:17 pm


  30. Shattno
    January 4, 2018 at 9:58 pm

    It doesn’t matter if your hobby is eating, drinking, fucking, collecting stamps or playing super mario. If you over do it, it becomes unhealthy and can fuck up your life. Everything in moderation.

  31. Shattno
    January 4, 2018 at 10:01 pm

    Wait, who is taking away people’s incentives to start a family? And how? And what is that incentive?

  32. Tubsiwub
    January 4, 2018 at 10:18 pm

    Games can have addictive components that are bad for some people such as what most mobile games are doing with their games-as-a-service design… but overall video games are the best hobby around. S’why I come to this site… I like all games, especially the niche ones.

    I’m a bit surprised that people would mock you for playing video games when you were younger. Obviously it’s not the same way now (especially where I work) but… damn is that hard to visualize. I imagine them making fake controller gestures to me, in which I’d reply “You’re holding it upside-down, moron.”

  33. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 4, 2018 at 10:26 pm

    bills, especially when countries like Russia are debating a “bachelor tax”

  34. Shattno
    January 4, 2018 at 11:01 pm

    Are we back to this? *sigh*
    I was asking an honest question, I don’t know what you are referring to. Here in Sweden people get paid to start a family.

  35. Mr_SP
    January 5, 2018 at 12:00 am

    Didn’t that happen to some WoW players in the past?

  36. bdp
    January 5, 2018 at 12:04 am

    Can’t entirely agree when people have actually died from playing games for too long.

  37. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 5, 2018 at 1:37 am

    Well, it’s not like Russia is known for having a lot of great ideas. :p File it under “Putin’s Plan to Restore Russia to It’s Former Glory #126”. But unless you live in Russia, it’s not that hard to be a bachelor. It the worst case, folks just might think you’re a closeted homosexual.

  38. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 5, 2018 at 1:39 am

    Gamers should just do what the metalheads of the past did… Give zero fucks what outsiders think.

  39. Loli ♥ Antagonist
    Loli ♥ Antagonist
    January 5, 2018 at 2:26 am

    My problem with smoking isn’t the self harm that it does. I couldn’t give a shit. My problem with it, is that it actively affects the people around you, and you whiping a cigarette means other people have to smell your trashy fucking addiction.


  40. SLoWMoTIoN
    January 5, 2018 at 3:36 am

    Fucking normies is doable.

  41. SLoWMoTIoN
    January 5, 2018 at 3:36 am

    Well deserved.

  42. Madbrainbox
    January 5, 2018 at 4:48 am

    I think we’re pretty good at giving zero fucks about what other people think about us and our hobby.

  43. Петър Стоянов
    Петър Стоянов
    January 5, 2018 at 5:05 am

    Might Help in your trials … recently I found a book about the 50 most common diseases, how to treat them and how to avoid generally being sick … http://www.myhealthlegacy.com/ – includes

    diets explanation + menu list

  44. Malascus
    January 5, 2018 at 5:27 am

    There was even one fellow I worked with who I befriended that would always give me these long lists of shows to check out, but I honestly never watched them.

    This makes me sad, he was probably just trying to be nice.

  45. Malascus
    January 5, 2018 at 5:29 am

    There’s a competitive l4d2 scene?

  46. BFG
    January 5, 2018 at 6:31 am

    Women in general
    Are you willing to take the risk in taking part in a relationship these days when society give a lot of things to women so they always end up having the upper hand? (abortion, divorce, alimony, social services, hired into workforce thus less time spent on family matters, etc)

  47. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 6:37 am

    Yeah, those pesky human rights are a drag. Saudi Arabia knows what they are doing, am I right.

  48. BFG
    January 5, 2018 at 6:41 am

    I wasnt aware that Europe in the first half of the 20th century (and centuries beforehand) was already invaded by muslims.

  49. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 6:45 am

    What? You know, whatever, I’m not in the mood.

  50. BFG
    January 5, 2018 at 6:47 am

    Hope you take a good look of your country (Sweden, especially the state of the cities) to see the current situation, and consider that women in leadership positions (such as politics) wasnt really a good idea

  51. SevTheBear
    January 5, 2018 at 7:12 am

    There will always be people who gets an addiction no matter what and it’s very easy to blame an industry. In the 60’s Rock music was blamed for all kinds of shit.

  52. BFG
    January 5, 2018 at 7:34 am

    Sweden yes

  53. SevTheBear
    January 5, 2018 at 8:18 am

    Yup, sounds like Sweden alright

  54. Wonderkarp
    January 5, 2018 at 8:36 am

    I live in my parents basement and play games…..
    Though I moved back in to live with them and take care of them as they grew old and handicapped. I have a Career and make good money.
    Just this past November I took the 2 of them to Disney World. I pushed my dad in his Wheelchair up and down all 4 of the Parks PLUS Universal Studios and had a grand time.
    Sure I played some Nintendo Switch on the plane, or late in the day at the hotel room. Who doesn’t?

    What I’m saying is the Basement Dweller Stereotype shouldnt exist because they arent looking at all the metrics of the person. Does the person suffer from Depression or some other terrible affliction already? Does the person live with parents by Choice to help provide for them?

  55. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 9:16 am

    It still has its hardships, but its easier and safer than getting married today.

    My point was that its not going to get any better when governments experiment with stupid shit like calling gamers mentally ill or wanting to add more taxes so single guys have to pay for social security.

  56. jim
    January 5, 2018 at 9:46 am

    Yes and Sausages also give you cancer so says WHO.

  57. BFG
    January 5, 2018 at 10:08 am

    They’re also blaming a symptom and not the cause

  58. RetroGamer
    January 5, 2018 at 10:09 am

    Metal songs have demonic messages if played backward and D&D turns normal, suburbanite kids into cultists! Oh, the early 90’s!

  59. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:33 am

    Well, they’re the ones with skyrocketing fertility rates along with getting the western world handed to them for free, so I’d say they’re doing much better.

  60. Mechonis
    January 5, 2018 at 11:19 am

    Eh, yes. Versus does buts it’s a mess. Matches can be very competitive and enjoyable but it’s are hard to find. There are actual tournaments (recently too) and they’re on Youtt

  61. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 11:20 am

    But I like the current situation, if you ask me we’re on the right track. We obviously have very different opinions.

  62. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 11:36 am

    Obviously she’s an idiot, what else is new. But if you think that she or her opinions are indicative of Sweden in general you are being very naive.

  63. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 11:38 am

    That depends a lot on what you consider to be successful, don’t you think?

  64. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 11:40 am

    Oh you…

  65. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 12:08 pm

    Scandinavian countries tend to have insanely high rates of anti depressant consumption, so I wonder if most of that happiness is just people numbing themselves.

  66. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 12:09 pm

    Demographically colonizing nations while getting free handouts and favorable media coverage sounds pretty successful to me.

  67. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 12:28 pm

    Well, not to me, so I guess we disagree.

  68. Jack Thompson
    Jack Thompson
    January 5, 2018 at 2:05 pm


  69. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 5, 2018 at 2:17 pm

    Some are.

    But some of the responses in these comments and the article itself suggest others are not. *Shrugs.* At beast, it’s preaching to the choir.

  70. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 5, 2018 at 3:08 pm

    People “risk” relationships because it’s in our nature and when they fall apart, it’s usually because both parties don’t communicate their wants and desires… That’s the bane of most human relationships, romantic or otherwise.

    Of course, there are a few situations where one party is truly innocent, but those are few and far between, and there’s just as many awful men as their are women. But considering I know a quite a few genuinely happy and healthy relationships between the people in the 25-34 age demographic… Well, it must not be that bad?

  71. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 4:28 pm

    I just want Swedes to be Vikings again, or at least turn into an army of Dolph Lungdrens.

  72. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 5, 2018 at 4:28 pm

    They aren’t calling gamers mentally ill. They are saying gaming can be an addiction.

    If you’re constantly cancelling events with friends and family in order to play your new game, or get your heat shut off in the winter since you think it’s more important to pay your MMO subscription, or buy that collector’s edition that’s to collect dust, you’re addicted and have a problem.

    Just like no one is going to say you have a drinking problem if you go through a six pack on the weekend, if it doesn’t effect your relationships.

    Just like no one is going to say you have a gambling problem if you go to the casino, even every other weekend, and spend a couple bucks on penny slots.

  73. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 5:12 pm

    Why are games being specifically targeted? Shouldn’t there be a more all encompassing term for someone who neglects to take care of themselves?

  74. This is Mugen Tenshin
    This is Mugen Tenshin
    January 5, 2018 at 6:20 pm

    Truth be told, I don’t think this is fair. If you look at the other Scandinavian countries (Norway, Denmark, Iceland), then Sweden is clearly the odd one out, considering we were the same people genetically speaking.


    Scandinavians might be predispositioned to say we are happy, and generally have a positive look upon life, as we at the same time has had rather good results on the world stage in most aspects. I’d still say that most of the current difficulties of Sweden has come of late, and that the results of today’s politics will have long term effects, but actually have few short term effects.

    It won’t bother the average Swede for instance that some asylum seeker is hanging out in some tent in Malmö, however when the children of these people start being annoyed at society that their families are poorer than anyone else (because they were asylum/welfare seekers), then that’s when the real impacts will start to show. For instance the police was recently exposed for covering up crime, deliberately misrepresenting statistics and in general their media’s facade is starting to crack as more and more people get involved in some of the negative aspects of immigration. They have however inherited a position in the world where they have had good neighbors and has avoided war for a very long time, all while they also had numerous international enterprises (Ikea, Volvo, etc.) several innovative and successful solutions, and are technologically advanced as they invest in new technology right away, just like their neighbors, and has a high adoption of new tech. That said, it seems they are squandering what their parents have given them, and act irresponsible, where the country have a hard time hiring their own youth (many of them now work in/move to the neighboring countries).

    Most of the policies are similar across borders for the Scandinavian countries, though Denmark is the strictest ones on immigration where this is the only big policy that separate these nations. Denmark is even so strict that several European institutions has accused them of violating the humans rights, etc. Even so, Denmark is clearly the winner on the graph by a year to year ratio. (Iceland is also pretty strict, but poor, while Norway is fairly strict, but fairly wealthy.) The most logical explanation is that Sweden as a country and people has historically made a lot of wise decision, but that immigration is clearly impacting them negatively (I also think that it’s an exponential function, meaning the negativity to come from it will increase rapidly).

  75. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 8:24 pm

    No…relationships fall apart today because women’s hypergamy is no longer kept in check. The government has become the surrogate husband for them with welfare, alimony, and child support. This fucks guys over severely, which is why marriage and birth rates are dropping in the west.

    A marriage should be a legally binding contract, not a glorified one night stand.

  76. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 8:36 pm

    I like the vikings too, both of my parents are archeologists and I grew up, got my university degree (at the oldest university in Scandinavia) and still live in a city that used to be a (if not the most) important religious and political center for the vikings. I sometimes drive out to the old royal mounds and the old church that was built on top of what was once the temple where the vikings sacrificed to the gods every nine years, it’s beautiful. The entire landscape here is positively littered with runestones. The vikings are definitely an important part of my heritage.
    Anyway, the way they are portrayed in popular culture is a bit misleading, sure some of them where explorers, traders, pirates and raiders, but most of them where just ordinary farmers, just like most people in the world where at the time.

  77. Shattno
    January 5, 2018 at 8:59 pm

    I mean I think Scandinavians are happy because they live long and safe lives, and enjoy freedom and democracy. I claim it’s tightly bound to the Nordic model.
    But yeah, Sweden has dropped down in recent years (but I mean look at it, it’s really close at the top), and it would be a lie to say that this has nothing to do with immigration, we have definitely taken more than our share and that puts a strain on society. But I chose to be optimistic, I believe that the long term effects are going to be a net positive. Give it two or three generations.

    Are you kidding me? Beaten by the Norwegians, that’s a national disgrace. Something has to be done, we need to lay more fiber asap.

  78. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 9:53 pm

    For starters, the “stating arguements” and then rebutting them is lame. It takes away any sense of conversation and you just appear to be a jackass.

    Secondly, gaming can be extremely addictive, now more than ever. The rise of free to play games and the microtransactions have astronomically increased the addictive nature of games, and people more prone to addiction in a bad way. Sure you can sit around the campfire and jerk off the “it’s not a REAL addiction like alcohol and drugs,” but then you read a story about a mother being arrested because her two year old was malnourished and filthy because mom was playing Farmville.

    Finally, because it doesn’t happen to you, or because it seems silly, doesn’t void the conversation. I have a 25 year old friend in England, never had a girlfriend, just got his first real, steady job and will most likely never leave his parents but you can bet your ass he didn’t go complete apeshit when Splunkey 2 was announced. He has an issue, but who am I right?

  79. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 9:55 pm

    You fed that troll waaaayyyyy to much, condolences.

  80. MasonF2
    January 5, 2018 at 10:08 pm

    Strange that Iceland is so high when they have the highest usage of Antidepressants in the world.

  81. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 10:08 pm

    I mean, “asshat” is a perfectly acceptable term for one who neglects to take care of themselves.

    “Victim” for those who neglect to take care of themselves due to being mentally reliant on a outside source and having (outside their own control) to chase the high.

    Oh lawd I used the “V” word in this community, here come the 12 year olds with the digital pitchforks!

  82. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:15 pm

    Its nice that you’re not a total bugman in that you appreciate your culture. Just know that if you continue to let the government take care of women, then fertility rates will continue to drop, more immigrants will pour in(whom oppose your culture), and then Sweden will be Swedinistan.

    Its already bad enough that the McDonalds over there have arabic coupons.

  83. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:18 pm

    I just think its stupid that videogames get their own special term when the behavior of a videogame “addict” is easily applicable to anyone else who over indulges in a hobby.

    Also I’m not sure what you’re getting at with that last part, but I’m just going to assume its weak bait.

  84. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 10:23 pm

    It’s not bait, you can’t hear the labored breathing accompanying the 350lb footsteps? If there’s one thing I’ve learned in this group, you don’t say “victim” and leave unscathed.

  85. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:34 pm

    “you can’t hear the labored breathing accompanying the 350lb footsteps?”

    Judging by the croaking toad neck you’ve got in your dp, this remark seems like projection.

  86. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 10:44 pm

    Oh that’s cute, going to profiles to bash. It’s actually just a neck, but at least you tried Mr. Everything is Private ???

  87. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:46 pm

    “just a neck” lol, a neck that shows 30% body fat XD

  88. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 5, 2018 at 10:48 pm

    Also, you’re the one who went out of his way to bash this community, so don’t be so assblasted when you get put in your place :)

  89. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 10:56 pm

    You think that’s 30% then that’s the nicest thing any goblin has said to me all day. I wait for the day you surpass your insecurities and show yourself to the world!

    Ps, it is a bad pic >.>

  90. Zanthos
    January 5, 2018 at 10:59 pm

    Whoa whoa, I did not bash the community, nearly the lot of you that get so vehemently upset when the word “victim” is said. I’ve been here since day 3, albeit not very active, and am saddened at some of the trends it’s taken.

  91. This is Mugen Tenshin
    This is Mugen Tenshin
    January 5, 2018 at 11:06 pm

    Well, I don’t necessarily disagree, but Japan or South Korea should have been on the top if those are the criteria alone. However, I would agree that the “flat” workforce and trust based culture we have contributes towards a better society. However this also puts a lot of responsibility on the individuals of the nation. If you get too many that break this mutual trust through opportunism (which is common in almost all other cultures except far East-Asian) then it all collapses in need for better security.The Nordic model is based on mutual values and understanding, and immigration could undermines those unless they get properly assimilated (not integrated, but assimilated). That is arguably currently not happening some places (Malmö), where you get enclaves of people with their own value structures and culture. How you think and what values you end up getting is also partially linked towards genetics (did you for example know that the likelihood of you becoming religious is actually more based on your biological parents than your adoptive parents… pretty weird huh), where the Western world is rather unique in that we put individual rights above that of family or group responsibility. These clashes of viewpoints usually makes a particular set of values view the other set of values as evil, and vice versa.

    It’s also some things not entirely consistent as this other person her mentions. Sweden’s suicide rate is ranked 46th (mostly driven by high male suicide numbers). Comparable to Iceland at 65th, Norway at 102th and Denmark at 105th, it’s a pretty high leap. Actually, Sweden’s suicide rate is the highest in all of the first world (not counting East Europe, Japan and South Korea) with the exceptions of Finland and Belgium. As such it is kinda peculiar that both Sweden and Finland scores so high in happiness overall when there clearly are many that chose to end it. In Sweden’s case I believe this is linked towards the political correct environment/lack of tolerance towards diverging viewpoints (freedom of speech is not real if the consequences would be that you get bullied and branded as “unemployable” in the biggest newspaper for saying something controversial), and in Finland’s case alcoholism, but those can be debates of another time.

    Not to burst any bubbles, but the long term effect of your current immigration will be negative. This is guaranteed, and can’t really be debated, unless you’d want to debate the fundamentals of social sciences all together. One can approach it from an economical viewpoint, but I prefer the genetic aspect as they are more certain and closer to the natural sciences (aka. more certain). You take in low skill, and with that presumably low IQ individuals. Considering which regions you take people from this is almost guaranteed at larger numbers, even if some could be doctors and engineers from their origin country, the odds are very high that the average would be at least 10 points bellow that of ethnic Swedes. IQ is one of the most inheritable traits there is at 0,7 (mostly genetics). Further on, low IQ is correlated towards crime, unemployment, and other “unwanted characters traits”. However, it is also correlated towards a higher birth rate, meaning that if you got decent welfare systems put in place… then society will evolutionary push towards having even more low IQ individuals in the future, which again would result in an even more violent and unstable societies. The end point will either be an American system where you disband welfare benefits, or you split up into different nations based on values or you morph into some version of communism (and we all know how that ends).

    However, if the technological advances continue and one manages to stay competitive internationally, then those advances may help to diminish the worsening effects. If one at the same time allows ladies to chose their partners as individuals, then they would usually go for someone “equal or better than” themselves. This again could balance out the previous effects.
    Either way this will be a long term negative effect, and you have to struggle to make it successful despite it, and not hope to gain anything because of it. The US has managed to do it fairly well though, and I hope you’ll manage too.

    Did you know Seoul has 10 000 mpbs down/up internet? Did you also know South Korea has close to free 5G for their citizens in all of their country? Imagine playing online games lag free from your freaking phone! No wonder these guys rule the competitive gameplay world!

  92. Bitterbear
    January 5, 2018 at 11:28 pm

    Pretty much the legal system in all English-speaking nations have evolved to be hostile towards men to the point the lawyers will tell the men to bend over, because it’s safer for them in the long run.

    Pair to that that the courts are rife with activists judges..

  93. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 1:09 am

    At least in America men can get access to some, if not most, forms of welfare. Considering that European countries tend to have better economic safety nets, most Western countries offer similar services.

    And if you feel that dudes aren’t getting married or having kids, you need to broaden your horizons and talk to people, dude… It has a lot more to do with an increased cost of living without a comparable increase in pay and the fact that you raise a kid off one income anymore.

    I’ll also agree marriage should be more than a gloried one night stand… But acting like it’s only women that don’t have respect for it (or even committed relationships) comes off as naive.

  94. BFG
    January 6, 2018 at 5:17 am

    At least in America men can get access to some, if not most, forms of welfare. Considering that European countries tend to have better economic safety nets, most Western countries offer similar services.

    Welfare is cancer considering this is the main reason why mass immigration is present in Western Europe. They dont come in eastern european countries because welfare doesnt exist there.

    And if you feel that dudes aren’t getting married or having kids, you
    need to broaden your horizons and talk to people, dude… It has a lot more to do with an increased cost of living without a comparable increase in pay and the fact that you raise a kid off one income anymore

    Arabic and black families have no issues to own a lot of kids though

  95. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 6:23 am

    Well I don’t know anything about that, I just found it weird as I’m in my mid 30s and most of my friends and relatives are getting married and plopping out kids left and right, I’m running out of drinking pals fast…

  96. BFG
    January 6, 2018 at 6:32 am

    You take risks when there is something worth rewarding and beneficial to you in the long run.

    Relationships with womyn are hardly worth the risk considering it’s a literal landmine zone, while they have all the cards in their hands. And I didnt even mention the specific set of laws on separate countries (alimony to girlfriend in Canada, paternity DNA tests forbidden in France, etc)

  97. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 6:41 am

    Shit, these things are so exaggerated. I grew up in an working class area full of immigrants that in today’s sensationalist media would have been called a “war zone”, I had zero problems. I currently live pretty close to one of the so called “no go zones” and I go grocery shopping there every once in a while, it’s just another neighborhood. Twice i my life I have gotten beaten up, both times at around 3 a.m. outside some bar by by some drunk swede because I talked to his girlfriend earlier. Statistically the most dangerous place to be is outside a bar in the middle of the night on a weekend.
    I’m not saying Sweden is perfect or that crime dosen’t happen, but come on…

    Anyway, my advice to you is to take the things you read on the internet with a grain (read: shovel) of salt.

  98. BFG
    January 6, 2018 at 6:47 am

    Considering my country is living under more or less the same shit as Sweden (mass immigration, cities becoming more and more unsafe due of the large amount of foreign ethnicity, etc) I can safely said you’re full of shit.

  99. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 6:58 am

    Fertility rates dropping has more to do with the fact that we are transitioning from a industrial economy to an post industrial economy, so it’s hard to find jobs that don’t require higher education, so more people go to university and try to make a career and put the family stuff on hold and we as a nation end up having less kids being born. (And I mean seriously, is more people really what this world needs?)
    Besides, I don’t think immigrants oppose Swedish culture, it’s more that they (understandably) want to keep their own. Fuck, my Kurdish neighbors celebrated the princess’s wedding more than any of the swedes in the neighborhood.

    Anyway, as I wrote in a reply to someone else, it may be tough right now, but give it two or three generations and it will sort itself out, this isn’t the first time in history this has happened. Also remember that change is the only constant.

    (I mean I couldn’t care less about what language McD print their coupons in, but if you know arabic I guess you could get a cheaper burger)

  100. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 7:22 am

    As I said to someone else, the happiness index is complex, I should probably have posted the legend as well https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b89a69a113212edb05f02baeb11b7163915d363ec19366e6de136c6c454f81aa.png

    I would absolutely not link suicide with PC culture, I would say it has more to do with (just like in Japan and South Korea) a high pressure to succeed but also, seriously, the long dark winters, people tend to get a little depressed when they haven’t seen the sun in like four months.

    I was actually mostly talking about it from an economical standpoint. But from an cultural standpoint, immigration being negative or positive is of course subjective, I personally welcome the culture of entrepreneurship that some immigrants bring. But again, highly subjective.

    But you talk about genetics and IQ. Firstly, IQ is a pretty shitty measuring stick, secondly IQ isn’t 100% genetic (not even close) and thirdly, as I said before, it might be a problem right now but in a few generations it will balance itself out. Besides, since when is introducing new genes to the gene pool a bad thing?
    I’m certain the long term effects are going to be positive, at least history suggests so.

    I did know that! I have a few friends from South Korea, and from what I hear Seoul is supposed to be a really cool place (except maybe it’s proximity to North Korea), I should really visit as soon as I get some vacation.

  101. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 7:29 am

    Well, I don’t know what to say. I don’t really have any problems living here (or in any large city for that matter). So, lucky it’s me living here and not you, I guess?

  102. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 9:13 am

    To address your first point, a large part of that problem is also allowing women to work, thus taking more jobs away from men, and less women having kids in their fertile prime. The muslim immigrants have kids in large amounts because their women are only allowed to be mothers and housewives. And yes, a nation with a shrinking fertility rate needs more people, otherwise there wouldn’t be a need for third world immigrants to come in and fill the gap.

    Second point doesn’t negate what I said. They prefer their own culture, and in numerous generations when they out populate you, the whole country is going to be their culture and their language, the no go zones are a good indicator of this.

  103. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 9:18 am

    Less people are getting married each generation, I think only like 30% of millennials are married. The cost of living is a problem, but combine that with the crony divorce laws that favor women, and its no wonder guys avoid while women crow about “where have the good men gone?”.

    Women have 0 sentimental value for marriage, they just go for whatever provides for them the best, this doesn’t make them evil, its just their maternal instincts.

  104. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 10:31 am

    When you say shit like “allowing women to work”, like they are second class citizens, it makes me sick to my stomach. I don’t really want to continue taking with you.

  105. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 10:35 am

    Nowhere did I say second class citizen. I think motherhood is the most important role in nature, and to shun that for a shallow and soul crushing career is the real sickening act.

  106. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 11:04 am

    You said allow, like women can work but only if men say it’s ok, so second class citizens are kind of implied. That kind of shit goes against everything I stand for.

  107. Madbrainbox
    January 6, 2018 at 11:15 am

    I’m thinking of personal attacks here mostly.Yeah,some people are doing what Carl said he’s doing in this article and simply say they have other hobbies.But many are simply admitting they are gamers and just ignore the reaction.After all,why would you want to interact with people that are judging you?
    But when the hobby is under attack by outsiders,be it Jack Thomson,Anita or the GG shitshow, then we’ll defend our hobby.

  108. Lea Pastillaroja
    Lea Pastillaroja
    January 6, 2018 at 12:03 pm

    Gaming is only an adiction when there are good games to be adicted to
    and the west has alrready taken care of administering the cure for such adiction

  109. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 12:05 pm

    It was men who voted to let them work, and men in positions of power who passed the laws to allow it. Women can’t enforce anything on their own, otherwise there would have been tons of revolutions in Sharia based countries.

  110. This is Mugen Tenshin
    This is Mugen Tenshin
    January 6, 2018 at 12:07 pm

    Well, the part about PC culture is only my suspicion, it could be totally off the mark, but using Norway, Denmark and Iceland (and Finland) as references, then we can try to see what sticks out. The weather is pretty similar in Sweden to Norway and Denmark, so I don’t really know if that explains it, but winter depression is a thing indeed. As for SK/Japan I know they got a severe problem with overworking themselves to death, but I can’t say I’ve seen anything of that in Sweden (nor that it would indicate the same type of culture, but again, I could be wrong). I actually read that report (happiness) in full at the begging. They are only control questions and how people view it to be themselves. As such it is fairly broad as people tend to be bad at evaluating themselves, but still an interesting report.

    I said the inheritability of IQ was at 0,7, which means mostly genetic (1,0 means it’s fully genetically, 0,0 means it’s all environment). The sources for this is adoptions projects, twin studies, etc. If you say IQ is a “poor measuring stick”, then I would argue you illustrate a lacking understanding of the field. It is actually the most researched and understood tool within the social sciences, and if you can’t acknowledge it, then you can’t acknowledge anything else within the field. This might be a very frank statement, but if you are young I think you should be told it fairly strictly as you’d (be forced to) learn this later eventually anyways, so the earlier you get the “ideas that it might be a thing”, the easier it would be to adjust later. If you understand the science behind it, then you’ll see it explains more of how the society ends up looking than any other known measurements, just take this and the explanation of the job market (educated in the university of Toronto): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjs2gPa5sD0

    Also, as for Swedes, I would not be so quick to dismiss biology in general as well, as the scientific evidence is actually quite clear, but that some political parties find it “sad” and stigmatizing against certain groups. It doesn’t make it any less true, where the world isn’t what you want it to be, nor what it should be. It is what it is. If you take actions based on fallacies, then you can never hope to accomplish anything good, no matter how good intentions. I suspect (though I may be wrong) you might be somewhat subconsciously inflicted by the currently dominating political parties in your country, which are pretty hardcore science deniers on this field at times. If I was a politician I’d probably lie about it myself (or at least not say it), as you don’t get popular by saying stuff like this unless the recipient is fairly well informed in the scientific methods and values truth over comfort.

    Well, true. Depends on what you mean by long term though. Women actually is drawn towards success, and (since success is correlated to IQ and IQ is inheritable)… If you give women freedom to pick their own partners, and have a society with a competence hierarchy, then the genes of the “good, successful and peaceful” will prevail. As such it doesn’t matter from what part of the world the biggest population samples is taken from, it’s all about the individuals choice in mating (or more that they don’t select the “1%” that are a “burden on society”). We actually see that the IQ has increased over the years, mostly due to healthy food and safe upbringings, but I’d also assume natural selection (however, notice that I have no evidence supporting that hypothesis).

    That said, humans tends to be tribal, which means they might have a hard time crossbreeding at times. History has shown this to be a difficult dilemma to manage and if there are little to no cross-breeding, then you get separate societies within the countries which again give negative isolating effects. History shows that this can give quite severe consequences, where you even had places like Kosovo where different ethnicities tried to commit genocide against each other even if they “merged” 500 years earlier.

    That said, I hope you manage to make the best of it. You’ve already made the choice of adopting a new identity as a nation, and I wish you luck in your endeavors. (If you fail, you’ll hurt your neighbors too after all, so try making it work you guys!).

    Speaking of potential bad neighbor. If you really want to see how you can prevent IQ from impacting society in a positive way (if you take away the competence hierarchy and replace it with a power hierarchy (one of which only the most ruthless controls everything)), then you can funnily enough look to North Korea and South Korea. Genetically speaking they are the same people, yet one of them are arguably one of the best places to live in the world, and the other is basically a modern concentration camp/the worst place to live. If I had North Korea as a neighbor I’d be pretty unhappy too, as you’d feel a severely lower safety.

  111. Lea Pastillaroja
    Lea Pastillaroja
    January 6, 2018 at 12:10 pm

    if you marry you are automatically singing off half of all your posetions to the female who can take them away from you with just one lawsuit
    if she doesn’t take it everything away by crying “rape” in wich case you will be guily even after prooven inocent beyond all reasonable doubt
    and you can forgget about having kids, cus they’ll be HER kids and be lucky she lets you see them
    Not to mention the fad of the “empowered” womyn has striped the modern woman of almost all feminity wich is what men actually look for in a wife “then they wonder why so many men flock towards 2D waifus”

    and not to mention how prices constatnly go up while salaryes go down, and you can forget about getting help from the goverment if you are part of the working class cus all the welfare shekkels go to Tyrone’s pokets so he can waste it on fried chicken and watermelon

  112. Lea Pastillaroja
    Lea Pastillaroja
    January 6, 2018 at 12:15 pm

    you believe that shit?
    Sweeden is becoming a subhuman infestedhellhole, the rape and murder capital of the first world and you can’t even speak against it otherwise the (((diversity))) police will lock you up in a (((re-education))) goolag
    even if you are underage
    i don’t have the jpg saves but i did read they did that to a kid for being nationalistic and even jailed a woman for fighting of her nigger would be rapist

  113. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 1:12 pm

    It’s because of people like you there are feminists, I hope you understand that.

  114. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 2:19 pm

    I suppose I don’t understand why people feel the need to *defend* the hobby in the first place…

    Almost every other subcultural identity got just as much shit as gamers have, but they just shrugged it off and weathered the storm… It didn’t matter what outsiders thought, they were simply wrong… Gamers on the other hand seem to take things a lot more personally, despite the fact that the thing they are into that sometimes gets more shit is a hell of a lot more socially acceptable than other things.

  115. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 2:28 pm

    Look, you write a lot, and I have the flu, so ill keep it short.
    I understand IQ, but it’s a poor measuring stick because it measures mostly logical problem solving, if you combine it with measuring EQ you get closer but it’s still hard to “measure” people. IQ is a lot less hereditary than you think, at least on a macro level, humans haven’t changed genetically since the neolithic, yet a modern man has a far higher IQ than a cave man, this i because of environment and not genetics. This said, genes absolutely play a part, a person definitely owes some of his or her intelligence to the parents, but to draw conclusions about entire groups of people based on this is a bit much. For example, a prodigy growing up without intellectual stimulus would amount to nothing while even a halfwit can learn decent math with the right education. You say it yourself at the end, North and South Koreans should be equal because of genetics, but because of environment they are not.
    I think in general you overestimate what genes and natural selection mean for a modern society. I’m not saying it doesn’t play a part, just maybe not as much a you think. Then again, humans are extremely complex, so I doubt anyone knows exactly wat’s going on.

    As for Sweden, of the 10 million living here about 16 percent where born outside of Sweden (I’m one of them) but about half was born in neighboring countries (again, I’m one of them), so that makes for about 8 percent non European immigrants, even if one accepts the theory that some people carry around “stupid genes”, and the immigrants have more of them, and we assume they are evenly distributed among the populations, how much “dumber” do we get? And surely other genes will be introduced as well, some of the with positive traits, so we may end up with a net gain, genetically speaking. This will of course take tens of generations if not more.

    All in all i’m not so worried about the country in genetic terms, that smells to much like eugenics to me, but i’m more interested in the economical aspects. We are basically importing a work force, the hospitals and the elder care here are basicly run by immigrants. Sure it costs now with integration an whatnot but it will pay for itself in the coming decades.

  116. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 2:34 pm

    “the rape and murder capital”
    “lock you up in a re-education goolag”
    “jailed a woman for fighting of her nigger would be rapist”

    Right. You’d have to fucking retarded to believe that shit.
    Pro tip, take the propaganda for what it is, lies.

  117. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 2:38 pm

    Again, the financial reasons are a bigger factor than anything else. Getting married means you’re starting a family… And starting a family is a huge, financial burden these days. Without some sort of incentive, like religion, a lot of people would rather just take care of themselves.

    And if you think all, or even most women, have no sentimental value for marriage… You’re spending too much time on the manosphere or 4chan, just like the women who think every man is a rapist spend too much time on feminist blogs.

    If you think an entire group of people is nothing but trouble, you will never have good relations with them.

  118. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 2:41 pm

    Yepp, 50/50 split, tha’s how marriage works. Don’t like it, get a prenup Or you know, don’t get married in the first place, no one is forcing you. Don’t know what else to say, except maybe please don’t reproduce. Ever.

  119. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 2:41 pm

    You’re free to believe that, just like some women are free to believe that every man will rape them… But then, you’re just setting yourself up for a self-fulfilling prophecy of your own creation.

  120. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 2:50 pm

    Arabic families have kids because of their religion. Devout Catholic families and Mormons also have kids. Black folks often have kids for the same reason poor whites often have kids… Lack of affordable birth control and ignorance of how to obtain it.

    As for welfare being cancer… You’re free to believe that. But hey, you’re free to believe at lot of things. Despite the fact that at least with the people I knew on financial aid of some sort where never proud of the fact and only got on in because of special circumstances.

  121. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 2:59 pm

    What I’m talking about ties into financial issues. If a man risks losing all or most of his assets over bullshit like alimony and child support, then he will just stay single.

    As for the second point, you’re strawmanning me. I said its a woman’s biological instinct to look for a mate that can provide good enough resources for raising a family, you see this throughout the animal kingdom with stuff like the male bower bird giving gifts of food and shelter to females. This unconditional romantic love you’re alluding to is just a product of Victorian era fantasy that has no basis in biology.

    So I don’t blame women, I just blame the laws that make it harder for men to start families.

  122. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 3:01 pm

    Nope, its mainly ideologues in positions of institutional power who seek to destroy the family unit in order to make more money off of higher taxes. This was the plan of the Rockefeller family when they funded and founded feminism.

    Thinking that women organized in a grass roots fashion is simply not grounded in reality.

  123. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 3:42 pm

    I’m sorry. For a second there I forgot you were a conspiracy theorist. Wont happen again, promise.

  124. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 4:23 pm

    Not an argument.

  125. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 6:33 pm

    Lol that quote is a double edged sword. Calling someone a conspiracy theorist is dismissive and its an ad hominem.

    Here are some sources and citations to back up my argument, but I don’t expect you to listen anyway since its easier to dismiss anything that hurts your feelings as a “conspiracy theory”.




    I’ve got quotes too: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9f02eaac3fd383e9e94da2b1a6357b86b0ffb8ac73f0866f475448950e1060a9.jpg

  126. SevTheBear
    January 6, 2018 at 6:34 pm

    I wonder where North Korea is on that list :P

  127. SevTheBear
    January 6, 2018 at 6:38 pm

    Someone let the door too the insane asylum open again xD She is nuts

  128. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 7:09 pm

    Judging by the fertility rate dropping among the natives combined with the hordes of immigrants, in a few generations it will be a mostly mix raced and mostly African country unrecognizable to what it is even today. The only ones who benefit from this outcome is the people who are taking over, while you chose to smile as you die out, but as long as you have your soma i guess, then its all good.

    FYI: IQ hasn’t been proven to be determined by environment. Otherwise Africans who grew up in Europe or Asia, where the average IQ is much higher, should have higher IQs themselves. Also wonder why the whites in south Africa have some of the lowest crime and highest IQ in the continent…




  129. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 7:41 pm

    Was the Rotherham scandal just “exaggerated”?

  130. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 7:46 pm

    They’re not. Simply because you can’t ask them how miserable they are. It’s really sad, I truly feel for them, must be a living hell over there. :(

  131. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 6, 2018 at 7:51 pm

    This supposed biological urge doesn’t seem to factor into any lasting, meaningful relationship I’ve seen in my life. But you know what has? Empathy, communication, and compromise. I’m not suggesting the sugar-coated, flawless Disney love is a real thing but human beings absolutely are capable of forging genuine relationships that go beyond simply what’s best for themselves.

    And I’m not meaning to strawman you… I just legitimately don’t know anyone who thinks in the sort of way that you’re presenting outside of a very vocal minority on the internet. The fear of getting taken to the cleaners isn’t on the mind of anyone I know, including divorcees.

  132. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 8:01 pm

    “supposed biological” urge, yes because plenty of deadbeat or struggling men have women chasing after them because of their “commitment and communication”. Its not like women have a natural incentive to provide the most ideal circumstances for their children…

    If were going with anecdotal stuff, I’ve known people who worked as divorce lawyers and told me first hand the whole thing is an industry designed to screw men over.

  133. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 8:13 pm

    No, those reddit posts and youtube videos are clearly being spread by the Chinese government in order to destabilize western society. The alt-right, SJWs, feminists and ISIS are all just puppets controlled by Mao Zedong, who faked his death and are controlling china, and soon the world, with the help of the majestic twelve.
    (This is not what I believe, this is what you sound like.)

    I reality you can’t understand why the world is not like you want it to be, why people have different opinions than yours. So you’ve built this alternate reality around you where everything is a conspiracy, because that’s the only way the world makes sense. And with your cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias you find other delusional people on the internet and take their incoherent ramblings as confirmation you are right. It’s sad, really.

    And now I’ve stepped on a nerve pointing this out, so you replied to all my other comments trying to push you “facts”. Guess what, I’m not going to waste more time on you. If you want to discuss video games sometime, I’m up for it. But no more politics or religion, life is just too short.

    All of this just because I didn’t understand what you where referring to in you original comment, so I asked politely what you meant. Boy do I regret that now.


  134. Shattno
    January 6, 2018 at 8:14 pm

    Ok, cool. Let’s touch base 2030 and see how it went.

  135. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 8:23 pm

    Thank you for conceding :)

  136. Kiryu
    January 6, 2018 at 9:17 pm

    No wonder Sweden is the rape capital of Europe with nutjobs like this.

  137. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 11:44 pm

    I can’t even play as much as these supposed “addicts”. Whenever I get burnt out, it gets to the point where I start numerous games and give up over the slightest bit of trouble or if the beginning is too slow.

    I usually take a week or two off, and then I get cravings to play again.

  138. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 11:47 pm

    Colbert: “If videogames don’t turn you into a killer, then how do they turn you into a misogynist?”

    Anita: “uhh..um..like..idk”

    Colbert: “Name me three games with misogyny”

    Anita: “uhh…I dont have to answer that”

  139. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 6, 2018 at 11:54 pm

    A lot of boomers and Gen X people still view videogames as a childish hobby that only socially inept nerds play past the age 12. They still haven’t accepted yet that its gotten more socially acceptable and that its surpassed the audience numbers of film and television.

    Because of their outdated perception on games, they support labeling it as a mental illness, even though they’re actually just attacking the symptom instead of the problem.

  140. Mighty No. 56008
    Mighty No. 56008
    January 7, 2018 at 1:43 am

    ….I really don’t understand the issue here. ANYTHING can becoming an addiction, “real” or otherwise, and some just feel that gaming is prevalent enough to recognize it. That doesn’t necessarily mean that they are outright villainizing the hobby or even lifestyle.

    Of course my tone or opinion will change if this results in more people trying to influence what is “acceptable” in my games, or if gaming packages starts to put up those “warning labels” on them.

  141. Phasmatis75
    January 7, 2018 at 7:28 am

    Unhealthily Habitual. No chemical dependency in the brain, no addiction label.

  142. Phasmatis75
    January 7, 2018 at 7:31 am

    With reproduction rates and Marraige rates at all time lows, no people are not risking relationships.

  143. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 7, 2018 at 10:59 am

    you fed yourself too much, literally XD

  144. Zanthos
    January 7, 2018 at 11:29 am

    Oh I remember when I couldn’t think up compelling arguments and could only use insults four days later, then I turned twelve ???

    I miss those days actually, it’s much easier to be a thoughtless waste of space!

  145. SevTheBear
    January 7, 2018 at 12:14 pm

    Asian Boss channel on Youtube have a few interviews with people who has escaped from North Korea. If there is a hell on earth, it’s there and anyone here in the west that thinks ANYONE here has it hard, haven’t been to North Korea.

  146. Crizzyeyes
    January 7, 2018 at 12:24 pm

    You’re still missing the forest for the trees, his point is that literally anything with a reward mechanism can be addictive, but the ones which don’t alter your brain chemistry are so common that it seems a little silly to waste resources on them when they could be spent on researching ways to treat people that abuse substances that are actually dangerous. Ask yourself how commom gambling addictions are in the face of, say, overeating and food “addiction” especially here in the U.S.

  147. Shattno
    January 7, 2018 at 12:39 pm

    I heard that the latest horror they have to endure is everyone being infected with parasites. Apparently there is a shortage of fertiliser so they use human feces instead and this spreads parasites like ring worms. That one guy that ran across the border and was shot but survived was apparently so full of worms that the South Korean surgeon who operated on him said he had never seen anything like it. What a complete nightmare…

  148. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 7, 2018 at 12:47 pm

    Coming from the guy who called me a “troll” and labelled this whole community as angry 350 lb fatsos.

  149. This is Mugen Tenshin
    This is Mugen Tenshin
    January 7, 2018 at 3:11 pm

    My aim was not to argue for any sort of eugenics (on the contrary, “people” who decide what genes are “worthy” has always done a poor job historically, and simply pick people who are “like themselves”), I’m just saying that a free market could prevent the eugenics of devastating forces unintentionally, which is why it works the best in the long run everywhere it is implemented. This is a view that support your claim that in the long run things might work out if you accept these rules, however that also means you have to abandon the Nordic model and the welfare state as a concept.

    The IQ rant was more a foundation as for having a free speech and a free society, rather than an oppressor vs victim mentality (where people must be protected from harmful truths). If you control for IQ you’ll quickly find that there are far far far less discrimination in society than you think, and likewise if you believe there are no difference between people, then you’d quickly conclude that any difference of success between the groups must come from discrimination alone. This again would push society towards an equal outcome rather than equal opportunity world, which are societies based on power instead of competence (communism). Notice that equal opportunity and equal outcome cannot co-exist, as they are opposites. Smart people are not immune towards this type of thinking, and high IQ does not equal wise. Even after China’s great marsh, Soviet’s gulags, The Third Reich’s concentration camps, Pol Pot’s genocide or North Korea’s ongoing mass murders, then people still bring up those ideas as possible because they are theoretically feasible (in an ideal world), but in practice impossible, largely based on how humans are as people and not having equal potential or temperament. What all these societies share is 0 tolerance towards wrong-think, and I must sadly say that you see some similar signs of early traits in today’s Sweden which is why I worry.

    When it comes to the concept of IQ as a measurement then I feel you perhaps speak words of people other than yourself, rather than having done the research and lifting yourself. I myself am however also at fault for not mentioning enough sources to back up my claims. However, I believe that if you truly understand IQ (and the G-factor in particular), then we wouldn’t have this conversation as, this is one of the most researched and understood factors within the social sciences with tons of attempts at disproval, but where it still stands solid within the rules of the scientific method. In short, if you can’t accept it, then you can’t accept anything else within the social sciences either. The fact that you mention EQ, which is complete and utter bogus in my view, signify to me that you are perhaps not ready to have that particular conversation, so I’ll diverge away from it as I don’t think it will be fruitful. However, I can state that there is little uncertainty to it if you can comprehend the statistical data, and EQ is easily proven wrong because it does not follow the fundamentals of the scientific method. The fact that EQ are people measuring themselves while IQ is other people measuring you is a drastically difference in approach alone, but I’ll let it go (sorry, I can go at great lengths as for everything wrong with EQ, it’s nothing but a poorly shaped personality and temperament test in my view).

    I gave you the inheritability number of IQ though (approx 0,7 based of numerous adoption projects and twin studies), so I don’t really feel that there’s much more to discuss at uncertainty there. That number actually tells you 99,9999% as for how things will manifest exactly on the macro level, but it does not tell you how individual children of each couple will turn out to a greater degree. So I feel you got those two wrong! For instance if you have n=1000 children of parents of IQ 100, and 1000 children of people of an IQ of 80, then there’s a 100% chance that the average is higher in the first set. There will be individual children that are smarter from the second group than the first group, but the average will graduate towards the mean of each groups parents, and the average as such will be closer towards the average of the parents. I’ve just explained the correlations between it and other behavior, and of course environment plays a part (on IQ it basically boils down to nutrition and “not extremely abusive upbringing” (accessibility to play, love, etc)), but it always get pushed to play a much bigger part than it actually has. I’d say as much as 90% of who you become is decided on birth (I have no evidence for that statement, this is me guessing) as most people have “normal lives”, and if you are not put into an extreme situation of either abuse or malnutrition that only 1% of people in a modern society gets to experience.

    You can destroy people with big potentials early, I’ve never denied that not to be a possibility. However, being “smart” is not evolutionary advantageous alone either, though it is advantageous in a liberal and free world that benefit everyone. An example of this are the Jews, that are the smartest people on the planet. They’ve been hated by many because of this, even attempted to be made extinct. I am guessing this usually steams from jealousy, and an inability to see that. Just because they became successful it shouldn’t automatically be assumed they steamrolled over everyone else to become so. They are not perpetrators with victims, and contributed a lot in the societies they operated, and the reason for why there’s so many Nobel price winners among them is not random. This again roles back to my first point that we must accept that different groups would contribute differently, be it positive or negative on the macro level.

    Humans have changed a lot, but if you look over a 100 000 year perspective, then there are still people around that looks similar now as back then without going extinct. The same thing can be said about chimps in a 5 million year perspective, they are still around, that doesn’t mean modern humans doesn’t exist.

    It is precisely the economical aspect I’d worry about. The immigrants you import will get old too. They’ll also drive on your roads, use your healthcare, use social goods. If the output is lower than the input, which the economical data clearly indicates that are the case (see the Brockmann report as an example (Swedes have no report, so you have to look at either Norway or Denmark’s data)). Again, I said the short term effects will be minor, but when their kids grow up and adopt different value based tendencies (which you are already seeing in increased crime rates) and they themselves get old, then you’ll have a harder time unless the technological advances manages to cover up for the loss in workforce efficiency and attitude. That said, in a 1000 year perspective it’ll probably go ok, but I really feel it’s unethically of you to throw your own children under the bus to such an extreme degree. Then again the manifestations are also uncertain in a 50 year perspective from the elements I just mentioned, and if North Korea nukes us all, then it doesn’t really matter in the end (joke, even if true).

    I get your view, I just tried to make this one a 2 paragraph thing, but then I just started to write only to look back on it now to correct any spelling errors… This can’t be healthy.

  150. Shattno
    January 7, 2018 at 5:32 pm

    I won’t argue you over IQ, you seem to have a pretty good grasp on what’s going on, my scientific field is computer science, I understand machines not humans, so I’m probably talking out of my ass. But I still have a feeling that IQ is not entirely understood and is not telling us everything, I guess what I’m saying is we need more data.

    The economical aspect is probably the only one I don’t worry about. Yes the immigrants will get old but will also help supply a new generation that will eventually replace them, just like all people. They will drive on roads and use healthcare and social goods, but they will also pay tax and some of them will work in construction, healthcare and social services. It’s true that if the output is lower than the input it’s bad for the economy, but it’s not going to be like that forever. Give them a few years to learn the language and adapt to society, and they will become cogs on the wheel that makes the country go round, so tho speak. Just look at the Iranians that came here in the 80s, hard working people that contribute to society and a second generation also contribution to society and has a high percentage of university graduates. A similar pattern can be seen with the people from the Balkans that arrived in the 90s. A lot of people tend to think of immigrants as lazy and stupid thieves and parasites, and some of them are, some of all of us are, but most of them are just regular people. People that had everything taken away from them and were forced to flee. Most of these people just want to get back to normal. I’m not saying everything is perfect, there are some pretty shitty things happening right now, these are the short term negative effects, and we should focus on trying to minimize them as much as possible. This is an election year in Sweden, so it will be interesting to see how the politicians suggest we solve these problems.

    Regarding values, yeah of course they will change some, values always do, the values in Sweden today are not the values of the 50s and those were not the values of the turn of the last century. The only constant is change. you know. And I’m not really talking about a 1000 year perspective, that is more for a genetic perspective (If you ask me humans won’t even be around as a species in a thousand years.), the economical perspective is more a 100 year one. But as you say, it’s uncertain, no one can see into the future. All we can do is make our choices and hope for the best.

  151. drunken monk
    drunken monk
    January 7, 2018 at 5:48 pm

    Lol, but some metal objectively does have lyrics about satanic worship and other dark elements. Problem is demonizing a whole group and its fans over issues with a niche/ sub-group.

  152. drunken monk
    drunken monk
    January 7, 2018 at 6:08 pm

    Damn, you resurfaced my knowledge of days gone by. It was a concerted sociological/ psychological effort to dismantle the Western nuclear family unit, and feminism was twisted from an equality movement into a ruse to achieve further gender division and unhappiness.

  153. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 7, 2018 at 6:22 pm

    iron sharpeth iron

  154. Sean Sharpe
    Sean Sharpe
    January 7, 2018 at 8:55 pm

    Or… They are in relationships, just not getting married or having kids.

  155. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 7, 2018 at 9:28 pm

    I know we finished this debate, but I just wanted to respond to this by saying first time marriages have a 92% chance of failure after ten years, and a 50% of failure each year up until then.

    If your country gives welfare to single moms along with forcing men to pay alimony and child support, then most of those marriages won’t last, unless the husband makes a really good living, I’m talking like white collar good.

  156. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 7, 2018 at 9:31 pm

    Millennials have been reported to have some of the lowest amounts of sex out of any generation, most likely because of the rise of hookup culture, porn, and Yes Means Yes laws where women can revoke consent.

  157. Kiryu
    January 7, 2018 at 10:01 pm


  158. SevTheBear
    January 8, 2018 at 4:05 am

    That’s really fucked up

  159. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 8, 2018 at 1:03 pm

    Prenups are thrown out in court if the judge feels its “unfair” to the woman. If prenups worked, then divorce would be at an all time low, because then women can’t cash out anymore with alimony, child support, and welfare.

    “please don’t reproduce. Ever.” Holy shit, you say this while defending the orcish hordes swarming your country. No wonder Sweden will be a third world shit hole in twenty years.

  160. This is Mugen Tenshin
    This is Mugen Tenshin
    January 8, 2018 at 1:47 pm

    I see, well with the rise of automation and AIs (which is/will be well within your expertise) I believe you stand a good chance at at least keeping it at an equal standard of living like now. Historically speaking we are the most privileged people in all of history regardless, where our average standard of living wasn’t even accessible for the king of kings just a hundred years back. If you maintain a competence based society free of world views that see successful people as oppressors (and with that discrimination at every group difference), then I think you’ll do just fine tbh. Some bumps sure, but not horribly.

    Nice talking to you!

  161. Shattno
    January 8, 2018 at 2:39 pm

    Yeah, I honestly think automation will change a lot in society, just like the industrial revolution did. I’m really curious about what will happen.

    Nice talking to you too. :)

  162. TheOnceAndFutureKing
    January 8, 2018 at 2:57 pm

    not an argument ;)

  163. Shattno
    January 8, 2018 at 3:13 pm

    Fair enough.

  164. RedPanda87
    January 9, 2018 at 8:07 am

    Came in expecting this article to be trash (as frankly a lot of this site’s editorials are) but actually think you put forward a fairly well-reasoned argument and made some points I hadn’t considered. I certainly don’t agree with all of it, and am still more inclined to believe “well-respected scientists” on what does/should count as an addiction, but this was an interesting read.

  165. Phasmatis75
    January 9, 2018 at 4:35 pm

    Nope statistics show that isn’t happening either. Enjoy the collapse.

  166. Lea Pastillaroja
    Lea Pastillaroja
    January 10, 2018 at 7:34 am

    50/50? On wich decade were you left
    now a days you get lucky if you get just 10
    you haven’t seen many divorce trials latelly, have you?

  167. TiroDvD
    January 11, 2018 at 12:21 am

    That video is referring to the actual frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum in the air for broadcasting stuff and how it’s being clogged by companies buying it up and the huge increase in mobile communication and mobile devices. It is not referring to download bandwidth.