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Bethesda E3 Presentation: Quake Returns

With Quake Wars and Quake 4 having received lukewarm receptions, Id Software seems to have decided to take another crack at rebuilding their legacy, with a new chapter in the series, the PC exclusive Quake Champions.

Quake Champions is a competitive online shooter built for high end play and is intended to be both fast and fluid, with unlocked framerates and classic style 90s PC arena FPS combat. As a PC exclusive game, it shouldn’t be held back in terms of visual fidelity the way the previous two games had been.

More info on the game will be shown at Quakecon in August.

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About

Carl is both a JRPG fan and a CRPG'er who especially loves European PC games. Even with more than three decades of gaming under his belt, he feels the best of the hobby is yet to come.



71 comments
  1. Jack
    Jack
    June 12, 2016 at 10:28 pm

    THERE’S WORSE THINGS THAN DEATH HERE

  2. Mr0303
    Mr0303
    June 12, 2016 at 10:30 pm

    For a moment I thought it was a MOBA due to the title. Glad it is still an FPS.

  3. STARSBarry
    STARSBarry
    June 12, 2016 at 10:34 pm

    man im hoping theres no classes and its just pure arena shooters….

    Of course if they wanted to have a “Quake Fortress” mode I would be down for that, TF2 really never felt like TFC and its high time for a skill based shooter with classes to return.

  4. BaronKrause
    BaronKrause
    June 12, 2016 at 10:42 pm

    Yeesssss!

    Though Quake Wars was seriously underrated, that game played better than any crappy Battlefield i’ve ever played. They nailed making flying vehicles fun to operate too.

  5. Minuteworld92
    Minuteworld92
    June 12, 2016 at 10:43 pm

    *only on bethesda’s new drm platform

  6. RPGEndBoss
    RPGEndBoss
    June 12, 2016 at 11:17 pm

    Meant Quake 4, not 3. Sorry, just caught that.

    I hate writing articles for speed :(

  7. sanic
    sanic
    June 12, 2016 at 11:26 pm

    I’ll stick with the original competitive online shooter Team fortress 2 thank you very much.

    ᕕ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)ᕗ

  8. HouseOfBrick
    HouseOfBrick
    June 12, 2016 at 11:30 pm

    Though I want them to focus on MP, I hope they can squeeze a SP campaign in there, even if it’s short. Would love a return to Stroggos or even to Quake 1

  9. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 12, 2016 at 11:30 pm

    At least NuDoom sold like shit
    Not hopeful for this, but lets see how it goes

  10. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 12, 2016 at 11:31 pm

    Id be more happy with bots, but I dont think theyll bother with neither.

  11. Smug
    Smug
    June 12, 2016 at 11:34 pm

    disgusting

  12. No_Good_Names_Ever
    No_Good_Names_Ever
    June 12, 2016 at 11:42 pm

    Bethesda having anything to do with it pretty much means it’s gonna be held back.

  13. No_Good_Names_Ever
    No_Good_Names_Ever
    June 12, 2016 at 11:44 pm

    Who says if this one doesn’t do well, they won’t just turn it into a MOBA from you giving them the idea?

  14. Tyrone Jackson
    Tyrone Jackson
    June 12, 2016 at 11:54 pm

    >NuDoom
    You one of those fags that just wanted a Doom .wad as a new game in 2016?

  15. Tyrone Jackson
    Tyrone Jackson
    June 12, 2016 at 11:55 pm

    Kappa

  16. Tyrone Jackson
    Tyrone Jackson
    June 12, 2016 at 11:57 pm

    Yeah, this new MOBA-shooter garbage is stupid. I hope they don’t try to make it like Overwatch. Classes can work, but having “heroes” with skills and shit is weak.

  17. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 12:03 am

    No, Im the guy that wanted a good game and got a mediocre one.

  18. Dammage
    Dammage
    June 13, 2016 at 12:19 am

    “Quake Champions features a roster of unique characters, each with their own distinctive abilities, allowing you to fight the way you want.”
    “each with their own distinctive abilities”
    “abilities”

    Fuck…

  19. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:03 am

    there are classes, and to be honest i can see why they would pick this direction

    they see games such as Overwatch and Team Fortress 2 are very successful and Quake Live, well…

    they could tweak the formula just enough to make it feel fresh and perhaps attract more players, because theres no point on making the game just another Quake 3 when its been shown that direction doesnt have the best chances of succeding

  20. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:03 am

    “MOBA-shooter”

    you really dont know what you are talking about do you?

  21. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:05 am

    god you are such a nostalgiafag i bet you only breathe canned air from 1993

  22. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:06 am

    what if they make another Team Fortress mod for this quake?

  23. InkBrush
    InkBrush
    June 13, 2016 at 1:07 am

    Unless you still want to fork over sheckles for useless hats and keys.

  24. sanic
    sanic
    June 13, 2016 at 1:13 am

    Maybe but they’d also need to added hats, and MLP skins, I like to idle for hats as a horse.

  25. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 1:18 am

    Im sorry I dont like shit games that try to be Painkiller and fail miserably.
    Ill be buying Serious Sam 4 instead of that low effort garbage.

    Enjoy your buyers remorse though.

  26. Smug
    Smug
    June 13, 2016 at 1:21 am

    Nothing wrong in preferring older games when they’re actually better than most of the new shit we have now.

  27. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:28 am

    i wouldnt give the original DOOM so much credit, tough it is a good game… with several outdated aspects but good nonetheless

    i was insulting the guy for liking the originial DOOM but rather for being seemingly unable to see anything positive on anything developed in this millenium

  28. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:30 am

    wow you actually like something made this millenium, how incredibly generous of you, altough your comparison couldnt be any more flawed but dont let little details such invalid comparisons and inaccuracies get in the way of your arguments

  29. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:31 am

    well shit son, all those extra features are going to take atleast another 9 years of development, hopefully it’ll be worth the wait

  30. Zanard Bell
    Zanard Bell
    June 13, 2016 at 2:10 am

    Meanwhile, Quake 3 still exists.

  31. AsatorPrime
    AsatorPrime
    June 13, 2016 at 2:37 am

    Why does it have to have classes? Looks like I’ll be sticking to UT.

  32. GonzoLewd
    GonzoLewd
    June 13, 2016 at 2:37 am

    Didn’t everyone hate Quake 4?

  33. Madbrainbox
    Madbrainbox
    June 13, 2016 at 3:00 am

    The sensible choice.

  34. Madbrainbox
    Madbrainbox
    June 13, 2016 at 3:01 am

    I have a good idea for this game.Remove “Quake” from title.

    And on that note.Bethesda seems determined to shit on all the classics they can get their slimy hands on.

  35. Madbrainbox
    Madbrainbox
    June 13, 2016 at 3:04 am

    SS4?Is that a thing?

  36. scemar
    scemar
    June 13, 2016 at 3:08 am

    Quake.

    Now with some Overwatch in it.

    Will it manage to get people to play it instead of you know, just playing overwatch?

    Or will it turn off fans of the classic quake experiences instead?

    Perhaps a decent medium between both extremes?

    I like the idea of arena shooters coming back but I don’t like the idea of a Quake game that tries to be something it’s not and will probably fail at pulling off.

  37. StoneGhost
    StoneGhost
    June 13, 2016 at 3:36 am

    first you get a hearthstone clone of course.

  38. CoarseHock
    CoarseHock
    June 13, 2016 at 5:05 am

    Oh man, I fucking loved Q3A. Surely they can’t fuck it up that badly can—

    “Characters with their own unique abilities”

  39. STARSBarry
    STARSBarry
    June 13, 2016 at 6:19 am

    no I think he does… I think this new trend of combining elements that seem popular “MOBA Mechanics” and FPS and mashing them together would be fine if 1 or 2 games did it…. but now it appears every game is, so having a derogatory slang term for it is appropriate, since it will do the games trying it a disservice, which might put the fuckers off doing it in the first place.

  40. Madbrainbox
    Madbrainbox
    June 13, 2016 at 9:14 am

    Oh boy.I have many hopes for it and a few worries.
    Waiting on some info on it.

  41. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 9:17 am

    I could write an essay on why the game is barebones generic schlock that has awful mechanics like glory kill focus, long contextual actions, focus on locked arenas and poorly designed item drops due to the above glory kill focus and a severe limitations like very few enemies on the corridor sections and very few enemies in general with a max of around 12.

    And Im not going to talk about the awful piss easy bosses that test of patience rather than your skill.

    It wont matter, the game is barren and plays like a generic game made by Spark Unlimited or another low key company trying to make a quick buck on the console FPS genre in 2006.

    I wasnt expecting them to deliver Doom and I lowered said expectations to fit it being a reebot, its not Star Wars Battlefront levels if bad, but its generic, boring and has a severe case of wasted potencial just like mist triple A games releases in this decade.
    Its just not a good game

    Games barren but youll defend it to death because its Doom, its idSoftware by name, Bethesda and you can shoot demons with wacky guns while running moderatly fast, because thats what Dooms all about right?
    Level design and actual mechanics that dont fall preu to cinematic bullshit and a tacked on progression system?
    Pssshhh only losers like that, here, have some more forced plot and cutscenes when we previously joked about them.

    Well, I didnt want to, but heres your essay.
    Like I said before, enjoy your shit.

  42. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 10:13 am

    Why must every classic I love be fucked over like this?

    I want a Quake single player campaign, I want what DOOM recently gave us. That’s what you do with a game, bar the multiplayer, they should have just make it a classic arena shooter.

    Well, at least NOT EVERY classic I love is being butchered. UT and DOOM are still good enough.

  43. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 10:15 am

    The game sold well though, and you should drop the whole “NuDoom” shtick since the single player is fucking great.

  44. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 10:17 am

    DOOM is also very popular, and it’s almost a classic arena shooter, so why didn’t they actually follow up with what QUAKE was and should be?

    No one gives a flying fuck about copycats, they almost always fail.

  45. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 10:57 am

    It did so well that Pete Hines announced a demo and was literally begging people to go buy it.

    They advertised this very poorly showing only slow footage from controllers.

    And no, the singleplayer is mediocre garbage and it doesnt stand on its own.

  46. Madbrainbox
    Madbrainbox
    June 13, 2016 at 12:56 pm

    Well fuck.

    Back to UT with me.

  47. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:02 pm

    “glory kill focus”

    which speeds up the gameplay and encourages you to be aggressive

    “long contextual actions”

    barely a problem

    “focus on locked arenas”

    again barely a problem, it actually makes it impossible for you to just run away for health

    “piss easy bosses that test of patience rather than your skill.”

    you mean exactly like the first doom?

    protip: shoot at the cyberdemon until it dies

    “I wasnt expecting them to deliver Doom and I lowered said expectations to fit it being a reebot, its not Star Wars Battlefront levels if bad, but its generic, boring and has a severe case of wasted potencial just like mist triple A games releases in this decade.”

    even looking back at the golden age of FPS, i struggle to find one with the verticality and the weapon selection of D44M, so i dont know where this “generic” claim comes from, its certainly a lot different from the likes of call of duty or farcry, and its different from the classics too

    “Games barren but youll defend it to death because its Doom, its idSoftware by name, Bethesda and you can shoot demons with wacky guns while running moderatly fast, because thats what Dooms all about right?”

    actually yes, thats all DOOM literally is, shooting demons with guns

    “Level design and actual mechanics that dont fall preu to cinematic bullshit and a tacked on progression system? ”

    you are giving DOOM’s level design too much credit, i mean, for starters theres literally no verticality, the key hunting is just atrocious in some levels

    also theres nothing wrong with the progression system, it gives you shit like alternate weapon fires, which gives the combat plenty of variation, something the original severely lacked

    “Pssshhh only losers like that, here, have some more forced plot and cutscenes when we previously joked about them.”

    >implying

    theres varely any cutscenes in the game

    “Like I said before, enjoy your shit.”

    sure, enjoy your delusion

  48. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:04 pm

    the thing is that, it would be very hard not to (ironically) make a D44M clone while rebooting quake, the first quake was pretty much meant to be DOOM in actual 3D, so what happens when a 3D DOOM already exists?

  49. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 1:06 pm

    but theres barely any MOBA mechanics, hell you dont even know what the mechanics of the new Quake are?

    i mean look at Overwatch, the only remotely “MOBA” thing about it are the ults

  50. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 1:07 pm

    You make a Quake 2 reboot.

  51. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 1:08 pm

    ???

    Did you even see the sales or are you just using your hate boner to type instead of your hands in concordance with your brain?

  52. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 1:13 pm

    Don’t worry, it’s class based bullshit.

  53. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 5:23 pm

    They didnt brag about sales, theres still no sales chart, they would have been talking about it in the first week if it had sold as much as they wanted.

    “Hate boner”
    Why do you think I hate this game?
    Its mediocre, it isnt bad, its not worth 60 dollars, and certainly isnt Doom.

    I just feel like all the fanfare is done due to brand loyalty much like a Fallout 4 or Wolfenstein The New Order.

    They’re meh games, nothing special, dont do anything new and the old thats there is completely butchered.

  54. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 6:14 pm

    “They didnt brag about sales, theres still no sales chart, they would have been talking about it in the first week if it had sold as much as they wanted.”

    ???

    http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-05-16-uncharted-beats-doom-to-uk-retail-number-one

    http://www.shacknews.com/article/94944/doom-sales-reach-over-500k-on-pc-alone

    http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2016/06/09/uncharted-4-leads-strong-month-of-software-sales-in-may-npd.aspx?

    And these are just links from Wikipedia.

    “Its mediocre, it isnt bad”

    Based on what objective standards?

    “and certainly isnt Doom.”

    It surely is Doom, at least in the single player.

    “much like a Fallout 4 or Wolfenstein The New Order”

    Wolfenstein was good, don’t put it together with Fallout 4.

    “They’re meh games, nothing special, dont do anything new and the old thats there is completely butchered.”

    So you’re saying old DOOM is also crap then? Good to know.

  55. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 6:33 pm

    Second at retail at launch?
    That means nothing, they should need at least 3 Million to just to break even due to the marketing and development costs.

    Fucking Total Warhammer is selling more than it on PC.

    “Based on what objective standarts”
    The ones I have today due to good past games.

    “It sure is Doom”
    Are you saying Doom is a twitch shooter?
    Because you would be wrong

    “Wolfstein was good”
    Even the 2009 version was more enjoyable than that.
    None of the charm, but better gameplay and more interesting weapons.

    “Dont compare Fallout to Wolfenstein”
    Im not comparing it in terms of gameplay you idiot, Im talking about how both received praise by a grand majority whenone was mediocre and the other was shit.

    “So you’re saying Doom is crap”
    Now you’re just being obtuse, both these games offered so called “old school” mechanics and then prooced to butcher it with crutches and poor mechanics, that was my point.

  56. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 13, 2016 at 7:25 pm

    “That means nothing, they should need at least 3 Million to just to break even due to the marketing and development costs.”

    Based on what evidence?

    “Fucking Total Warhammer is selling more than it on PC.”

    Are you saying that’s some kind of achievement for that game?

    “The ones I have today due to good past games.”

    So none.

    “Even the 2009 version was more enjoyable than that.

    None of the charm, but better gameplay and more interesting weapons.”

    Yet no one really agrees on that matter.

    “Im not comparing it in terms of gameplay you idiot, Im talking about how both received praise by a grand majority whenone was mediocre and the other was shit.”

    Fallout 4 does not have a majority appraisal though (if we’re talking journalists, then kek), and how was it mediocre? Any objective standards?

    “Now you’re just being obtuse, both these games offered so called “old school” mechanics and then prooced to butcher it with crutches and poor mechanics, that was my point.”

    “butcher it with crutches”

    “poor mechanics”

    Yet that’s not actually present in the new DOOM, so what are you talking about?

    What poor mechanics? What crutches?

    Based on what objective standards?

  57. NuclearKangaroo
    NuclearKangaroo
    June 13, 2016 at 7:42 pm

    maybe i will smartass!

  58. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 7:55 pm

    Oh god, not this shit again, Im going to have to start copypasting everything thats wrong with this game

  59. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 13, 2016 at 8:24 pm

    Fuck it Im going to do it and copy this.

    -Focus on Glory Kills that kill the pace of the games, encouraging it by giving you health and ammo and discouraging you by making you need to waste ammo on them once they are staggered since theyll come back up
    -Extremely low enemy count in the open sections
    -Low enemy count in locked sections with barely any space on them
    -Focus on teleporting instead of actual good enemy positioning
    -Item drops are just thrown around with no sense to them aside from the secrets
    -Universal ammo
    -Tacked on progression system that needs to be used, else enemies will become bullet sponges, which is also why you cannot avoid doing executions on enemies, else your ammo will run out and youll be using the pistol for a shitton of time, making it fucking boring
    -Awful generic bosses
    -Contextual actions everywhere which play small animations, taking control from you
    -Forced cutscenes even if they went against in the intro
    -Boring platform sections with no tension

    Its a mediocre Painkiller wannabe.

    The game would have been decent if it didnt have the forced Glory Kills and progression, they completely ruin the whole game

    “You can just avoid it”
    No you cant, the games not designed with that in mind and becomes even more boring than it already is.

    “What evidence”
    This one
    http://archive.is/CUDCx
    Theyll still make a sequel since people love those in videogames like they’re a sign of any improvement nowadays.
    But no doubt about it, it was below expectations and in part due to how fucking cinematic and slow they made it out to be.

    And are you seriously telling me that a legendary brand like Doom, an FPS selling less than Total War, which is part of genre thats considered “dead” by most people is not a bad sign?
    Are you really being purposely obtuse just to defend this mediocre garbage?
    Come on now

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ss8SyOhqk1I

  60. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 14, 2016 at 8:42 am

    “-Focus on Glory Kills that kill the pace of the games, encouraging it by giving you health and ammo and discouraging you by making you need to waste ammo on them once they are staggered since theyll come back up”

    The glory kills are too fast for them to kill the pace of the game, besides the theme fitting the game perfectly and being implemented as a game mechanic instead of it just being extra fluff (exactly because of the ammo).

    Also, if they’re staggered, they’re not dead.

    “-Extremely low enemy count in the open sections”

    They spawn similar amount of enemies like Doom 2, so that one was a crap game then?

    “-Low enemy count in locked sections with barely any space on them”

    This is just preference/subjective, the above at least had a proper comparison (besides the fact that you’re wrong on enemy count).

    “-Focus on teleporting instead of actual good enemy positioning”

    So basically, instead of focusing on one trick pony maps, they make it so that the AI (since the AI is way better than in the previous DOOM’s since they can do that) positions itself and uses the environment.

    You’ve probably missed the parts where all the enemies can jump ledges (except the simple possessed), try to get higher ground than you most of the times (except melee units) and always fire, in movement or otherwise.

    “-Item drops are just thrown around with no sense to them aside from the secrets”

    Based on what are you saying this?

    “-Universal ammo”

    You should have probably either played the game or looked at someone playing it before talking bullshit.

    “-Tacked on progression system that needs to be used, else enemies will become bullet sponges”

    What is this progression system you’re talking about? The upgrades?

    You get upgrade points by simply killing everything and finding secrets. So you already do what you’re supposed to do and you’re not forced to fuck over your own pace.

    All of the weapon upgrades are modules, which you can go without, but it’s preferable you don’t though because Nightmare mode is really a Nightmare without a stun bomb.

    The enemies being bullet sponges is a thing since the first level, it all actually depends on what weapons you have.

    They’re meant to you know, not die instantly.

    “which is also why you cannot avoid doing executions on enemies, else your ammo will run out and youll be using the pistol for a shitton of time, making it fucking boring”

    Besides the fact that you have ammo on the floor like in every DOOM game, this is just your (or most likely someone else’s since they made some stupid mistakes on how the game works already) preference based on how you dislike glory kills, yet one of the most popular mod is Brutal Doom, showing that glory kills aren’t universally disliked if they’re well made enough.

    And if they’re fast, it’s even better, since everyone is basically saying that the pacing of the game does not get fucked over by the glory kills themselves since they’re really fast.

    “-Awful generic bosses”

    Well, I can’t help you if you dislike the cyberdemon and the spider demon. Doom must not be your franchise.

    Hell Guards being “generic” is uhhh… Debatable, I guess?

    “-Contextual actions everywhere which play small animations, taking control from you”

    Everywhere? Whoever wrote this must be seeing things. There are some scenes in which you’re stopped in your track, true, those are far and in-between.

    “-Forced cutscenes even if they went against in the intro”

    This should have been part of the point above. Again, it seems you didn’t really play or see the game, there are like two instances where you’re really forced to stop.

    “-Boring platform sections with no tension”

    If you ignore the enemies, then yeah, the tension is not present.

    “Its a mediocre Painkiller wannabe.”

    Far too different.

    “The game would have been decent if it didnt have the forced Glory Kills and progression, they completely ruin the whole game”

    You have no idea what you’re talking about.

    “No you cant, the games not designed with that in mind and becomes even more boring than it already is.”

    So you basically dislike Doom as a franchise, since you dislike this game that is pretty much a re-enactment of the older games in almost every aspect.

    “This one”

    >shows me RE6

    No, this isn’t evidence.

    “And are you seriously telling me that a legendary brand like Doom, an FPS selling less than Total War, which is part of genre thats considered “dead” by most people is not a bad sign?”

    >Total War
    >Fucking Warhammer
    >Dead

    Total War Warhammer was released only on PC.

    Also…

    Do you know why RTS’s and 4x seem to be dead?
    That’s because they’re doing what the FPS genre did for quite a long time, they’re not releasing anything new and they’re relying on brand names and nostalgia.

    E.g. fucking Starcraft 2.

    So at that point, anyone sane of mind does not really engage in buying those games since you can actually play the older RTSs/4x that everyone loves.

    If you’ve never looked on Steamspy, the “dead” genre still sells even now though.

    That includes Total War.

    As for DOOM, the charts aren’t lying. It was an outstanding success, even if you like it or not.

    Uncharted 4 seems to have sold 2.7m, since DOOM is pretty much second placed with it, it sold similarly to it.

  61. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 14, 2016 at 9:49 am

    Everything here is opinion, misinfo and excuses, jesus fucking christ, did you pre order the Collectors Edition or something?

    “The glory kills are too fast for them to kill the pace of the game, besides the theme fitting the game perfectly and being implemented as a game mechanic instead of it just being extra fluff (exactly because of the ammo).”
    No, they’re not too fast, the’re 2 seconds long and make you static, it pretty much pauses the game, it pauses the action amnd speed of and FPS to show you a contextual animation, them being more than fluff, the mechanics being designed around it, is

  62. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 14, 2016 at 9:58 am

    So you have no argument then? That’s fine by me.

    “Everything here is opinion, misinfo and excuses, jesus fucking christ, did you pre order the Collectors Edition or something?”

    Nope, just watched a whole Nightmare run from start to finish in a single run.

    And no, everything I did not talk directly about was is based on opinion, which is why I only told you they’re opinions. The rest are based on analytics, AKA what the majority of players are saying.

    Or comparisons with previous games.

    “No, they’re not too fast, the’re 2 seconds long and make you static”

    Less than 2 seconds for most, maybe chainsaw ones on some enemies reach 2 seconds, 2 seconds is also not long.

    Also, chainsaw/glory kills can put you in a bad spot.

    “it pretty much pauses the game”

    No, that does not happen, it’s far too fast and fluid.

  63. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 14, 2016 at 11:17 am

    This is all just opinion, misinfo and excuses, did you preorder the Collectors Edition or something?

    “The glory kills are too fast for them to kill the pace of the game, besides the theme fitting the game perfectly and being implemented as a game mechanic instead of it just being extra fluff (exactly because of the ammo).
    Also, if they’re staggered, they’re not dead.”
    No they are not, its 2-3 seconds of an animation that pauses the whole action and pace, its a second long cutscene and its fucking tiring do to it all the time, the mechanics being designed around it like you said the (enemies not being dead when you stagger them forcing you to either waste ammo or click button for cutscene to get it) is whats wrong with the game, they barely even bothered to set up item drops when you dont use Glory Kills, its a fucking mess of items thrown around at random, play in Ultra Nightmare and with no Glory kills, you can fucking see this the whole problem if this fucking game is the Glory Kills not being fluff, Brutal Doom has them but they are not a core mechanic and dont affect the game the mod is based upon which wasnt build around them on firat fucking place, its optnional unlike the tiring action pausing second long cuscene animations.

    “They spawn similar amount of enemies like Doom 2, so that one was a crap game then?”
    What kind of bullshit am I reading?

    “This is just preference/subjective, the above at least had a proper comparison (besides the fact that you’re wrong on enemy count).”
    How is it preference?
    The game isnt honest at all, it shows you these big open areas, shows you 3 enemies at a time in 3 minute intervals and then prooceds to artificially lock you in in tiny fucking rooms for any enemies to show and yes the enemy count is correct, only 12 enemies plus 4 zombies onscreeen, the others just teleport in as you kill the enemies, you can blatantly hear another teleporting in as you finish one out.

    “So basically, instead of focusing on one trick pony maps, they make it so that the AI (since the AI is way better than in the previous DOOM’s since they can do that) positions itself and uses the environment.”
    What the fuck are you talking about?
    Most of the enemies just rush or fire at you when teleporting in with the occasional dodge, teleporting is just an excuse for them to shit on the level design that no longer needs to be good for the game to feel paced, and even then many OG enemies also teleported, but they were carefully put in in certain sections unlike this one which is most of not all teleportation in one way or the other.
    OG A.I could open doors, use elevators and would follow you around if triggered, making most late levels different when you play them.
    NuDoom ones can climb up and dodge sometimes, oh joy.
    And are you actually calling OG Doom maps one trick ponies?
    Come on now

    “Based on what are you saying this?”
    See above

    “You should have probably either played the game or looked at someone playing it before talking bullshit.”
    Are you telling me that there isnt Universal ammo when you bash the Pinatas?
    Because you would be lying

    “You get upgrade points by simply killing everything and finding secrets. So you already do what you’re supposed to do and you’re not forced to fuck over your own pace.
    All of the weapon upgrades are modules, which you can go without, but it’s preferable you don’t though because Nightmare mode is really a Nightmare without a stun bomb.
    The enemies being bullet sponges is a thing since the first level, it all actually depends on what weapons you have.
    They’re meant to you know, not die instantly.”
    When the shotgun cant shoot 2 meters ahead of it because you havent upgraded it yet you know theres something wrong.
    Why is this shit being forced unto me?
    Upgrading the weapons and your skills kills the pace of the game and action yet again and if you dont do it you’re forced to be bored to death by the progression system that makes the enemies into bulletsponges later on in the game.
    Its ass and shouldnt be there, make it a pickup, not a fucking tech tree.

    “Besides the fact that you have ammo on the floor like in every DOOM game, this is just your (or most likely someone else’s since they made some stupid mistakes on how the game works already) preference based on how you dislike glory kills, yet one of the most popular mod is Brutal Doom, showing that glory kills aren’t universally disliked if they’re well made enough.
    And if they’re fast, it’s even better, since everyone is basically saying that the pacing of the game does not get fucked over by the glory kills themselves since they’re really fast.”
    2-3 second animations repeatedly over the course of minutes is tiring, boring and pointless.
    Many times you waste more time doing these flashy animations than actual shooting the enemy, its shallow pointless shit.
    And are you actually excusing item positioning with this?
    Not even the worse levels in Painkiller were this bad, these fucking things are literally there to remind you that you’re playing Doom, the only ones that arent completely fucking bullshit are the armor pickups and even then you usually dont get past 50 armor.

    Well, I can’t help you if you dislike the cyberdemon and the spider demon. Doom must not be your franchise.
    Hell Guards being “generic” is uhhh… Debatable, I guess?
    Cyberdemon and Baron of Hell bossfights were memorable.
    You actually had to hide and take cover from the Cyberdemon and you actually had to avoid the Barons of Hell super fast super damaging projectiles and hope they didnt corner/crossfire you.
    These bossfights are just bad, theres barely any avoiding the enemies attacks, its just shoot shoot shoot shoot now for more damage

    The Cyberdemon was always shit, Ill give you that.

    “Everywhere? Whoever wrote this must be seeing things. There are some scenes in which you’re stopped in your track, true, those are far and in-between.”
    Press E to pick up key card
    Press E to open ammo crate
    Press E to kill enemy
    Press E to kick steel grate
    Press E to opem door
    Now watch the flashy control removing 3-10 second long animation.
    Want that secret?
    Please press X

    Maybe you’re just used to consolized garbage.

    “This should have been part of the point above. Again, it seems you didn’t really play or see the game, there are like two instances where you’re really forced to stop.”

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jINYICJI424

    “If you ignore the enemies, then yeah, the tension is not present.”
    Ill give you that one

    “Far too different”
    You’re right, Painkiller actually uses the locked arenas to its potencial instead of waddling around in mediocrity like NuDoom and giving you the illusion that big open mapd mean anything if they dont have enemies on it.

    “You have no idea what you’re talking about.”
    Not an argument, and barely an opinion

    “So you basically dislike Doom as a franchise, since you dislike this game that is pretty much a re-enactment of the older games in almost every aspect.”
    No son, you’re the saying that.
    If you actually think this is an accurate reanactement of Dooms mechanics and gameplay the you’ve never fucking played the originals, your Doom2 has the same enemies makes me think thats the case.
    I already explained why it isnt and all its faults.
    I very much love Doom and wanted this to be good, een as a standalone, but is not good, its mediocre.

    “>shows me RE6
    No, this isn’t evidence.”
    You asked evidence on how much a company needs to break even, I just gave you that
    Doom even had more development time and marketing so it cost even more.
    It you dont want to look at the build up evidence, including adding a demo to a game published by Zenimax, then Im sorry, you’re either ignorant or in denial.
    They did the same with to The Evil Within and that sold like shit.

    “Total War Warhammer was released only on PC.”
    I dont see your point, Doom should sell just by brand name alone and being a Bethesda game, its getting BTFOed a RTT/Turn Based Strategy hybrid that wasnt nearly has marketed.

    And 4X/RTS arent dead, I have no idea what you’re talking about, they’re just not mainstream, thats like saying 2D platformers are dead.

    “Uncharted 4 seems to have sold 2.7m, since DOOM is pretty much second placed with it, it sold similarly to it.”
    That sold well?
    A non console exclusive?
    Thats not even in the top charts?
    Was it real in your mind?

  64. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 14, 2016 at 11:17 am

    Disqus fucked up, just posted the essay.

  65. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 14, 2016 at 6:03 pm

    “No they are not, its 2-3 seconds of an animation”

    No, they’re not, they’re at max 1.5 seconds, most of them, they’re fluid and fast. You’re also making random statements, the items placed on the ground are like in every other item pickup game, it’s the same old shit.

    And uhhhh, no, you have no point with the whole staggering bullshit of yours. Yes, they stagger, no, you’re not wasting your bullets. If you dislike the staggering mechanic, that’s just you, but that’s not really an argument.

    “What kind of bullshit am I reading?”

    The truth.

    “How is it preference?

    The game isnt honest at all, it shows you these big open areas, shows you 3 enemies at a time in 3 minute intervals and then prooceds to artificially lock you in in tiny fucking rooms for any enemies to show and yes the enemy count is correct, only 12 enemies plus 4 zombies onscreeen, the others just teleport in as you kill the enemies, you can blatantly hear another teleporting in as you finish one out.”

    “shows you 3 enemies”

    I knew I did a good job not taking you seriously.

    Yeah, you can’t count for shit, I have really nothing to say except that you need to learn how to count.

    “What the fuck are you talking about?”

    On the original DOOMs having one trick pony maps, that’s what.

    “Most of the enemies just rush or fire at you when teleporting in with the occasional dodge,”

    Which did not happen in DOOM except for the zombies, if you can call that dodging, most enemies would telegraph their movement towards you.

    ” teleporting is just an excuse for them to shit on the level design”

    No, teleportation is not an excuse of any kind, it’s a mechanic that works, you not liking it does not mean much to anyone.

    The level design does not change much with the enemies teleporting when the enemies can jump to platforms, move around strategically, dodge, etc. You don’t need enemy placement of any kind because the enemies are always a threat to you.

    Or did you have problems with enemies respawning in the original DOOM?

    “OG A.I could open doors, use elevators and would follow you around if triggered, making most late levels different when you play them.”

    They do so here too, except that they don’t need to use elevators, open doors, etc.

    “Are you telling me that there isnt Universal ammo when you bash the Pinatas?

    Because you would be lying”

    That’s not universal, you do not get all types of ammo from every enemies.

    “When the shotgun cant shoot 2 meters ahead of it because you havent upgraded it yet you know theres something wrong.”

    Are you this retarded? This is another piece of information that is wrong because you didn’t actually look at gameplay or played it yourself. This literally does not happen.

    “Upgrading the weapons and your skills kills the pace of the game and action yet again and if you dont do it you’re forced to be bored to death by the progression system that makes the enemies into bulletsponges later on in the game.”

    The enemies do not become any type of sponges because you do not upgrade, play the game or watch a video.

    And no, upgrading your skills and weapons does not kill anything, just like looking for secrets does not kill the pacing of the game or exploring the level in the original DOOM.

    You’re just making random statements again.

    “2-3 second animations repeatedly over the course of minutes is tiring, boring and pointless.”

    They’re not that long, you’re just making shit up.

    “Many times you waste more time doing these flashy animations than actual shooting the enemy, its shallow pointless shit.”

    You’ve been watching “I’m too young to die” or some shit, because you’re not invincible in glory kills.

    Those flashy animations end really fast and are fluid too, as for it being shallow, that’s just your opinion.

    “You actually had to hide and take cover from the Cyberdemon and you actually had to avoid the Barons of Hell super fast super damaging projectiles and hope they didnt corner/crossfire you.”

    Oh, so you prefer taking cover rather than fighting the boss toe to toe in an open arena?

    CoD might just be your game.

    Jokes aside (you’re shooting yourself in the foot so hard), you probably didn’t even see the boss fights from what you’re saying:

    “These bossfights are just bad, theres barely any avoiding the enemies attacks, its just shoot shoot shoot shoot now for more damage”

    Since the Cyberdemon doesn’t let you fucking breathe a second and can almost one shot you, for example.

    “Press E to pick up key card”

    Those actual 2 seconds killed your gameplay, once every level.

    “Press E to open ammo crate”

    That’s not even 1 second.

    “Press E to kill enemy”

    1-1.5 second every once in a while.

    “Press E to opem door”

    It’s a technological limitation but I’ll give you that, doors take quite a while to open, about 3 seconds at max.

    Also, why did you post a video about some dude that doesn’t know how to edit his gameplay to actually show you cutscenes? He keeps on showing gameplay for minutes.

    You’re not making yourself a case that way. Even if it were an hour of cutscenes (lol), that would still not even be a relevant minority of the game time.

    “You’re right, Painkiller actually uses the locked arenas to its potencial instead of waddling around in mediocrity like NuDoom and giving you the illusion that big open mapd mean anything if they dont have enemies on it.”

    I have nothing to say to this, you’ve just given your opinion, not anything based on any fact.

    “Not an argument, and barely an opinion”

    That’s because you repeat yourself and I already answered this above in the same post you quoted.

    “I very much love Doom and wanted this to be good, een as a standalone, but is not good, its mediocre.”

    Again, if you don’t like the DOOM franchise, you can always find another FPS.

    “You asked evidence on how much a company needs to break even, I just gave you that”

    RE6’s budget =/= DOOM’s budget
    Capcom =/= Id/Bethesda

    Not evidence.

    Most companies do not cry at the amount of sales RE6 had. Or are you telling me Total War Warhammer sold like shit?

    “Doom even had more development time and marketing so it cost even more.”

    Based on what evidence?

    “It you dont want to look at the build up evidence, including adding a demo to a game published by Zenimax, then Im sorry, you’re either ignorant or in denial.”

    Nothing of what you posted was evidence though.

    “I dont see your point, Doom should sell just by brand name alone and being a Bethesda game, its getting BTFOed a RTT/Turn Based Strategy hybrid that wasnt nearly has marketed.”

    No, it’s not getting BTFOed by anything, it outsold TW:W, that’s my point.

    And it’s second highest sales, behind Uncharted 4, when Doom 3 was a failure and we didn’t get a real Doom in ages.

    “That sold well?

    A non console exclusive?

    Thats not even in the top charts?

    Was it real in your mind?”

    So you’re ignoring reality at this point. It was third in some charts and second in others.

  66. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 15, 2016 at 12:16 am

    Heres evidence disproving your “truth”.

    You’re being purposely obtuse, using ad hominem and strawmans to get your point across, including blatantly lying and not having any evidence to back up your claims.
    Im done after this reply, you cant be argued with.

    “Cyberdemon doesnt let you breathe”
    Are you kidding?
    Even the two guardians were more difficult than that and they were piss easy.

    I was laughing my ass off as I hopscotched his slow ass blade attacks away and avoided his slow ass projectiles and rush attacks that slowed him down even more and the fact that you kill him with a fucking long ass Glory Kill animation (just like every boss) is the most anticlimatic shit ever.

    Game is garbage, enjoy your Denuvo.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GC0Kdx0tPgQ

  67. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 15, 2016 at 8:29 am

    “Heres evidence disproving your “truth”.”

    You have no evidence, nor did you disprove my points, because you never had any in the first place.

    “You’re being purposely obtuse”

    No, I’m completely fine, it’s you that make shit up at every corner.

    “using ad hominem”

    Never did, but I guess you can’t make a difference between an insult and an ad hom. Note, one is a conclusion, the other is a premise.

    And I conclude that you’re a fucking retard.

    “and strawmans”

    Quoted you almost word by word, unless you think you said something else, then you need to check your mental health.

    “Are you kidding?

    Even the two guardians were more difficult than that and they were piss easy.”

    You didn’t even play the game and can’t get even your basic info about ammo right, why do you think I give a shit what you think?

  68. Master Bating
    Master Bating
    June 15, 2016 at 2:42 pm

    You cared enough to reply :^)

  69. Immahnoob
    Immahnoob
    June 15, 2016 at 3:16 pm

    When did I ever deny that I care about you replying or not? I said I don’t care about the content of your thoughts on the specific issue of DOOM.

    Otherwise, carry on.